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Paul Bortolazzo | PentecostalTheology.com
**Why is a Post-Tribulation timing of the resurrection false?**
*‘And to wait for His Son from heaven, whom He raised from the dead, evenJesus who delivers us from the wrath to come.’ 1 Thessalonians 1:10*
Supporters of a post-tribulation timing of His coming teach ‘after the ‘tribulation of those days’ represents the 70th week of Daniel. They insist the Son of Man will come back for His elect only after this seven-year period ends. This is ironic because it was the pre-tribulation teachers that invented this misleading label. In scripture, the 70th week of Daniel is never called the tribulation period, the great tribulation, nor the day of the Lord. But won’t those believing in a post-tribulation resurrection be prepared to get the victory over the Beast? I’ve heard this dangerous reasoning from so many. Why should we settle for another false interpretation? Clearly, His coming will be like the days of Noah. (Luke 17:26-30) Our Jesus exhorts us to look up for our redemption before His wrath is poured out on the wicked. (Luke 21:28, 1 Thes. 1:10) Post Tribbers are teaching the exact opposite. They are actually preparing believers to experience the wrath of the Lamb. (Rev. 6:17; 15:1; 16:17)
I emphasize again, nowhere in scripture is there a pre, mid, or post-tribulation timing of the resurrection.
The only way to understand when believers will be gathered unto Jesus is by studying the words of our Lord (Mat. 24:3-51, Mark 13:3-37, Luke 21:7-38), His prophets (Isa. 13:9-11, Joel 2:30-31) and His apostles (1 Thes. 4:15-17, 2 Thes. 2:1, 1 John 2:28)
Debbie Neil Thacker
If the dead are raised first then the rapture can not happen until the first resurrection happens. That is after the tribulation.
1 Thessalonians 4
13 But we do not want you to be uninformed, brothers, about those who are asleep, that you may not grieve as others do who have no hope. 14 For since we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so, through Jesus, God will bring with him those who have fallen asleep. 15 For this we declare to you by a word from the Lord,[d] that we who are alive, who are left until the coming of the Lord, will not precede those who have fallen asleep. 16 For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the sound of the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord. 18 Therefore encourage one another with these words.
Revelation 20
4 Then I saw thrones, and seated on them were those to whom the authority to judge was committed. Also I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for the testimony of Jesus and for the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. 5 The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended. This is the first resurrection. 6 Blessed and holy is the one who shares in the first resurrection! Over such the second death has no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ, and they will reign with him for a thousand years.
Lori Talbert
I’m pre-trib but I must disagree with a few points… Matt 24:21 and Rev 7:14 do call the last half of the week a time of great tribulation. Also there will be a resurrection at the time of His coming at the end of the 70th week…. after great tribulation, but not a rapture. I’d be interested in how you prove “great tribulation” isn’t referring to the last half of the week and how there is no timing of the resurrection in scripture.
David Lamon
You nailed it. Great Tribulation is compared to Jacob’s Trouble that occurs when the abomination of desolation occurs. The 31/2 years of the tribulation most everything is hunky dorey crafts will prosper and such, sacrifice will be allowed by the Jews as part of a false peace treaty as in peace peace but there will be no peace. The first 31/2 years is man’s tribulation, the last 31/2 is the wrath of God.
Monica Bennett-Ryan
Blah, blah, blah…
William Davis
Here is a question for all the PRE-TRIB people. Now the PRE_TRIB believe that the 7 Plagues come after the 2nd Coming. So the Bible says and describes the coming of Jesus in many ways, but one text is found in 2 Thess. 2:8, “And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming.” also Rev 6:15-17, Ps 37:38 2 Peter 3:6 and many others question is who gets 7 plagues if all others are dead?
Stephen FY Teng
>>>The latest & final revelation of the risen Jesus is in the book of Revelation:
Rev 1-3 : Jesus stern message to the 7 Churches.
Rev 4 : Church rapture of the dead & alive in Christ, as represented by John.
Rev 5-18 7-yr tribulation or Jacob’s troubles with 2 OT prophets & 144,000 Jewish evangelists to confirm Daniel 9 :27 & to the unbelieving Jews, period !!! Many left behind church fence-sitters/doubters & all unbelievers from all religions after witnessing the said rapture will cry out to Jesus to save them & many new believers will be martyred & immediately resurrected & are called tribulation saints.
Rev 19-21 Jesus returns to earth to Mt Olives together with His Church Bride for the millennium Kingdom together with the saved remnant Jews & tribulation saints. Satan, demons & all unbelievers will be cast into the hell of fire forever.
Rev 22 New earth & new heaven for all believers ( Gentiles & Jews ).
Kay Crick
The post-trib rapture of THE BRIDE is false for a number of reasons.
The Bride of Messiah is BARLEY, not wheat, and certainly not grapes. Barley is ALWAYS harvested in the spring around the Passover. Messiah and the saints that resurrected with Him were the first fruits of the BARLEY harvest. Their resurrections took place on the first day of the feast of Firstfruits.
If post-tribbers studied the Lord’s feast days and harvests, they would know that no grain is to be harvested at all until the first fruits offering is brought to the Lord God. The first fruits offering is the first portion of a larger harvest. Messiah and the saints in Matthew 27:52-53 ascended to Heaven and were presented before the throne as the first fruits offering. The Rapture of the Bride is the larger harvest when the remaining field of barley is harvested. If the first fruits of barley is gathered in the spring then so is the remaining field of barley.
The annual feasts yet to be fulfilled by Messiah are the fall feasts of Trumpets, Day of Atonement, and Tabernacles. These three FALL festivals will be fulfilled by Messiah when He returns to Israel. The Second Coming of Messiah will happen in the fall. Barley is harvested in the spring. There is no mention of a resurrection and rapture of the Bride to Heaven POST-TRIBULATION. Post-tribbers love quoting Matthew 24 as “proof” against the pre-tribulation fetching of the Bride. But what they havent noticed is that there is no mention of a resurrection. There is a resurrection AFTER Messiah returns just before the start of His Millennial reign. Exactly who are the “elect” in Matthew 24? Post-tribbers say its the Bride of Messiah. At post-Tribulation, as Messiah and His pre-Tribulation raptured WIFE descend to earth (Revelation 19), the angels gather up the elect from around the globe. This group is raptured to Israel, not to Heaven. According to Isaiah 11:11-12, the elect in Matthew 24 are the outcast of Israel and the dispersed of Judah from around the globe.
Isaiah 11:11-12 ~ “And it shall come to pass in that day, that the Lord shall set his hand again THE SECOND TIME to recover the remnant of his people, which shall be left, from Assyria, and from Egypt, and from Pathros, and from Cush, and from Elam, and from Shinar, and from Hamath, and from the islands of the sea. And he shall set up and ensign for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth.”
Matthew 24:30-31 ~ “And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven (the second time) with power and great glory. And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.”
Notice these things about Matthew 24:30-31: (1) no one is raptured TO HEAVEN, (2) there is no mention of a resurrection, and (3) angels gather up the elect.
At the fetching of the Bride there is a resurrection where the dead in Messiah will receive new glorified bodies. And we who are alive and remain will also receive new glorified bodies. These new bodies will be like our Messiah’s resurrected body. Does our Savior need the assistance of angels to carry Him to and fro? The glorified Bride of Messiah will be caught up to Heaven without any help from angels. So the elect in Matthew 24 are still in their natural bodies which is why a resurrection is not mentioned.
The elect are gathered up by the angels and “raptured” to Israel. I believe that ALL of Israel will be saved (spiritually speaking) during the first half of the Tribulation which would make the elect born again believers but not part of the Bride since those counted as the Bride are in Heavens bridal chamber throughout the Tribulation.
If the Bridegroom fetches His Bride at His Second Coming, shouldnt He be dressed for His own wedding? Have you ever seen a Jewish bridegroom dressed as a warrior king and wearing a garment dipped in blood?! Not what you wear to your wedding.
If the Bride is fetched at the Second Coming, how does she appear WITH Him and why is she suddenly referred to as WIFE (Revelation 19). When did they get married?
The Bride being fetched post-trib does not make any sense. Messiah promised the Bride that He was going to prepare a place for her at His Fathers house, the temple, in Heaven. He also promised her to fetch her and take her to this prepared place which is the bridal chambers in Heaven (John 14). At the post-trib rapture, Messiah does not take anyone to Heaven. Instead He sends out angels to gather up the elect, the outcasts of Israel and dispersed of Judah, from around the world to “rapture” them to Israel. So if the Bride isnt raptured until post-trib, she never goes to the place Messiah prepared for her.
Kristin Camp
In the pretrib Rapture, Jesus comes in the clouds as a Bridegroom to take His children out which is the mystery occurring in a twinkling of an eye where we will be changed and only His own see Him, in the second coming, Jesus rides in on the white horse and that day His feet touch the Mount of Olives and He captures the beast and everyone will see Him. Can’t be the same at all! No mention of the church in Rev 6-18, only the elite which are the Jews who come to Christ during the tribulation
Pamela Beasley
Jude 1.4
“And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,”
Paul Bortolazzo
First Thessalonians 4:13-14 Jesus brings with him the dead in Christ at His coming.
Condreth Ruthenberg
the realities in our senses we have to acknowledge, as possibility that some of us will believe as such, is one of the possibilities. as we are the vessel of the future. we are the part of it that will be responsible on what will be . in our hearts, we feel what is right and what is not. we choose what is best. we mold our own reality. sometimes we are not even aware that we are a part of what is happening. we need to wake up. what we think is not right, we should not agree. but alas, we are the bearer of what is the truth in our being, in our existence. in the end, even if we act on it or not, The Magnificent one who rules the existence of our universe will make things happen for us to be preserved. are we in denial? some of us is. nut it is a Divine cosmic forces of life that runs the power in us. we are vessel might not agree as we can refuse or we can go with the flow. yet we are not in control. what is most important in us is when we will know what is Divinely harmonious in us. we can be in the dark. we don’t understand. it doesn’t matter. we are merely the part of what is . we are not the decision. we are the receivers of what will be out of that decision. God the all powerful one rules. honoring the master will help us understand more and help us what is.that we are .
Varnel Watson
YES indeed it could be Ray E Horton Alan Smith
Ray E Horton
Troy Day I agree that pre, mid, post are all speculation. The answer is to be ready, doing the work of the Kingdom, no matter when He returns.
Varnel Watson
Ray E Horton which one is YOUR pick?
Ray E Horton
Troy Day I have traditionally been pre-trib, but am open to other options that have scriptural support.
Varnel Watson
Ray E Horton well ALL other options are LEFT BEHIND 🙂
Alan Smith
Does it matter WHEN He comes?
Varnel Watson
oh YES it does