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From the late Jack Kelley 03-15-2014
I’ve received several questions again about various rapture positions. Several of these questions have to do with the claim that in the Olivet Discourse (Matt. 24-25), Jesus, in effect, said the Church will have to endure all of the seven years of Daniel’s 70th Week, including the Great Tribulation. In this study, I will attempt to show why He could not have done so.
This won’t be a verse-by-verse study of the Olivet Discourse but rather a look at the verses within the passage that people use to support something other than a pre-trib view. If you want a verse-by-verse study, you can go to my four-part series entitled “The End times According To Jesus.”
It’s important to begin any study of this nature with a review of the overall context of the Olivet Discourse because it’s the most important factor in understanding what Jesus was really saying and to whom He was saying it. It will also help us see what was going on in the disciples’ minds.
It was just a couple of days before the crucifixion. Jesus and His disciples were walking over the Mt. of Olives toward Bethany where they were staying at the home of Mary, Martha, and Lazarus. The sun was getting low in the late afternoon sky, casting a soft golden light on the white Temple and its surrounding buildings. It was such a beautiful sight, the disciples called it to the Lord’s attention.
In reply, Jesus said, “Do you see all these things? I tell you the truth, not one stone here will be left on another; every one will be thrown down” (Matt. 24:2).
It was the second time they had heard Jesus say this. The first time was a couple of days earlier on what we now call Palm Sunday when He had told the people that because they didn’t recognize the time of His coming, the city would be destroyed (Luke 19:41-44).
He was holding the nation accountable for their failure to understand Daniel 9:24-27 where nearly 6 centuries earlier, the angel Gabriel had told Daniel of a 490-year period that would begin when they received permission to rebuild Jerusalem and culminate at the end of the age. Gabriel told Daniel that the Messiah would come 483 years into that period (Daniel 9:25). Sure enough, here He was, standing in their midst right on time.
There’s no indication from the Biblical record that Jesus ever spoke to the disciples about the fact that the coming Church Age would interrupt Daniel’s prophecy and delay its completion by about 2,000 years. In fact, from Acts 1:6, we learn that 40 days after the crucifixion, they expected Him to restore the Kingdom to Israel at that time.
It wasn’t until James explained things to them some 20 years later that they understood how Israel was being set aside while the Lord took a people for Himself from among the Gentiles (Acts 15:13-18). A word study on this passage will reveal a hint of the rapture, and shortly thereafter, Paul became the first person on Earth to present a clear teaching on the doctrine of the rapture (1 Cor. 15:51-53, 1 Thes. 4:16-17), saying He was revealing a secret in doing so (1 Cor. 15:51).
Therefore, on that afternoon on the Mt. of Olives, all the disciples could have known for sure was that 483 years of the 490-year prophecy of Daniel had passed, there were only 7 years left, and Jesus had just told them that the Temple — all of its buildings and indeed all of Jerusalem — were going to be destroyed. It must have been quite a shock to hear this, and it prompted four of them (Peter, James, John, and Andrew) to come to Him privately for clarification.
Comparing Daniel’s prophecy with what the Lord Himself had repeatedly told them, they were beginning to understand that Jesus was about to die, and so the questions they asked Him had to do with when the Temple and the city would be destroyed, what would be the sign of His (second) coming, and of the end of the age, by which I believe they meant the fulfillment of Daniel’s prophecy (Matt. 24:3)
These were Jewish men speaking with the Jewish Messiah about the future of Israel, and in His two-chapter answer, Jesus referred to Israel repeatedly but never said a single word about the largely Gentile Church or the amount of time that would pass before the final seven years were completed.
After some general observations about things that would happen, Jesus gave them this summary of the future.
“Then you will be handed over to be persecuted and put to death, and you will be hated by all nations because of me. At that time, many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved. And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come” (Matt. 24:9-14).
Not only is there no mention of the Church in this summary, several of the things He said are not even relevant to the Church. They were intended for Israel. For example, it’s Israel that has always been hated by all nations because of Him, it’s Israel that has experienced many turning away from the Jewish faith, it’s Israel that has to remain faithful to the end to be saved, and it’s Israel that has been promised a Kingdom on Earth as a testimony to all nations.
What Will Be the Sign of Your Coming?
Beginning in Matt. 24:15, Jesus gave the first specific sign of His coming, and once again, it concerned Israel. The abomination of desolation He spoke of requires a Temple, indicating a national presence for Israel in the promised land with people adhering to their Old Covenant relationship with God. We now know that hasn’t been possible for nearly 2,000 years, but the disciples had no idea.
The people Jesus told to flee when they see the abomination would be living in Judea, historically the area around Jerusalem. They were told to pray their flight won’t take place in the winter, when the weather in Jerusalem can be bad, or on the Sabbath, because covenant-keeping Jews are uniquely forbidden from traveling on the Sabbath (Matt. 24:15-20).
Jesus said the abomination of desolation will be the sign that the Great Tribulation is beginning (Matt. 24:21). This is a time when Jeremiah 30:1-11 tells us two things will happen; all the nations among which the Jews have been scattered will be destroyed, and Israel will be purified in preparation for the promised Kingdom (Jere. 30:11).
Jeremiah called this the time of Jacob’s trouble (Jere. 30:7), which is the Old Testament name for the Great Tribulation, and said it will result in David becoming their king (Jere. 30:9), something that hasn’t happened yet.
The Church is nowhere in view here, and in fact, both Paul (Romans 5:9, 1 Thes. 1:10) and Jesus (Rev. 3:10) promised that the Church will not be present for this.
“Then will appear the sign of the Son of Man in heaven. And then all the peoples of the earth will mourn when they see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory. And he will send his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other” (Matt. 24:30-31).
Some claim this is a description of the rapture, but if that’s true, it violates the Jewish context of the passage without any explanation or justification. It’s based on the fact that the Greek word for trumpet appears both here and in 1 Cor. 15: 52. But that is not an acceptable reason to tie these verses together, because there are other factors that make them obviously different. One is that in 1 Thes. 4:16-17 the only angel mentioned is “the archangel,” not some unknown number of angels scouring the heavens. Another is that it turns the rapture from a signless, secret event into one that can’t happen until there is a sign for all the world to see, and until the Second Coming is already in progress. It would mean that while all the world is standing there watching Jesus descend from heaven in power and glory, He will suddenly scoop up the Church and return to heaven without completing His trip to Earth.
It would also violate His promise, made personally and through Paul, that He will keep us from the hour of trial that’s coming upon the whole world, delivering us from the time and place of God’s wrath.
Those who see the rapture here claim that the Church is “the elect” the Lord was talking about. But I disagree. Throughout the Old Testament, Israel was called God’s elect, and since Israel was the topic of their discussion, it’s much more likely that’s who the Lord had in mind. Also, according to Daniel 12:2-3, Israel’s resurrection will take place at the Second Coming making it possible that Matt. 24:31 is referring to Old Testament saints being rounded up to receive their resurrection bodies.
Finally, there’s no mention of the Church being “the elect” in the gospels. In the only times the Lord mentioned the Church at all (Matt. 16:18 and Matt. 18:17), He did not use any form of the Greek word for “elect.” The first clear description of the Church as the elect did not happen until Romans 8:33, which Paul wrote over 20 years later. In my opinion, to think that the disciples would have understood the Lord to be referring to the Church in Matt. 24:22 and Matt. 24:31 is an unwarranted assumption.
So far, in His answer to the disciples, the Lord has given us an overview of the end times (Matt. 24:3-14) and then a more detailed chronological order; Abomination of Desolation, the Great Tribulation, and the Second Coming (Matt. 24:15-31).
And of the End of the Age?
Beginning in Matt. 24:36, He turned His attention to things that will happen after He returns. These will signal that the end of the age has come, and they provide His answer to their final question. We know this because of the specific way in which He identified the day of His coming as “that day and hour” (Matt. 24:36) and “at the coming of the Son of Man” (Matt. 24.36, 39). He was speaking of the day of His return.
Some people say that no one will be eating and drinking, or marrying and giving in marriage before the Second Coming like they were in the days of Noah. They say the terrible effects of the Great Tribulation will have made that impossible. Therefore Matt. 24:36-39 has to be referring to the rapture. But I think they’re missing the point. First of all, people have found a way to socialize and get married in the worst of times. But more importantly, I think the Lord’s point here was that just as people had no idea the world was about to end in the days leading up to the flood, no one will know the world is about to end in the days leading up to the Second Coming.
And notice how the Lord compared “the days before the flood” in Noah’s time to “at the coming” of the Son of Man rather than the days before His coming. The worst time ever to come upon mankind will have just ended. Man’s natural tendency after any catastrophe is to believe things will return to normal, but when they actually see the Son of Man coming on the clouds with power and great glory, they will finally know things will never be the same again. That’s why they will mourn when they see him coming (Matt. 24:30).
“Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other left. Two women will be grinding with a hand mill; one will be taken and the other left” (Matt. 24:40-41).
These verses are often used to support a rapture after the Great Tribulation. Aside from the fact that seeing them this way violates the context and chronology of the Lord’s message, as well as His promise to the Church, there’s a translation problem here. The Greek word translated “taken” means to “receive unto oneself,” and a form of this word provides the clue of the rapture I mentioned in Acts 15:13-18 where it’s translated “take for himself” (Acts 15:14). It literally means “to take for the purpose of carrying away.” Before the Lord turns back to Israel to fulfill the missing 7 years of Daniel’s prophecy, He will take for Himself a people from among the Gentiles and carry us away.
So the word “taken” in Matt. 24:40-41 is not a problem, but the word translated “left” means to “put away” and was often used in the context of a divorce.
Rather than being a description of the rapture, where Paul’s definitive teachings never even mention unbelievers, let alone their disposition, these two verses are a summary of the Sheep and Goat judgment (Matt. 25:31-46). Both take place after the Second Coming, and both involve the final destiny of believers and unbelievers who will survive the Great Tribulation and live to see the Lord’s return. Believers will be received into the kingdom, but unbelievers will be put away into a place of eternal punishment.
The Lord finished his explanation of things that will mark the end of the age with several parables that describe the judgments He will conduct after He returns. I devoted an entire study to the subject of these parables that you can read in my two-part posting, “Understanding the Olivet discourse Parables.” For the purpose of this study, let’s just review the clues as to their timing to help you see they cannot be meant for the Church.
Matt. 24:29 begins “Immediately after the distress of those days” and refers to the end of the Great Tribulation. Matt. 24:30 signals the Second Coming, with more detail contained in Matt. 24:36-44, including the first warnings that people on Earth will not know the exact day or hour of the Second Coming in advance. I believe this is due to the fact that both the Sun and Moon will have gone dark (Matt. 24:29), and it will be difficult to keep track of time.
Matt. 24:45-51 contains the parable of the faithful and wicked servants and describes how the Lord will deal with them “when He returns.” It ends with another warning that people won’t know the day or hour of His return in advance (Matt. 24:50).
Matt. 25:1-13 is the parable of the Ten Virgins (bridesmaids). The opening sentence begins with “at that time.” Everything from Matt. 24:30 forward has been about the Second Coming, so the phrase “at that time” refers to the time following the Second Coming. There are many other reasons why this parable cannot be about the Church that are detailed in the study I referenced above. Like the others, this parable ends with a similar warning about the unknown day and hour of the Second Coming (Matt. 25:13).
Matt. 25:14-30 is the Parable of the Talents. By the opening word “again,” we know that the Lord was referring to the same time as the previous ones.
And in Matt. 25:31-46, the Parable of the Sheep and Goats gives us the clearest indication of timing yet. It begins with, “When the Son of Man comes in all His glory, and all the angels with Him …” As I pointed out earlier, it’s the judgment of tribulation survivors, some of whom will be believers and will be welcomed into the Millennial Kingdom, while the others will be taken away to eternal punishment (Matt. 25:46).
The Church is the Bride of Christ, the most highly regarded group in the history of humankind, and the one with whom Jesus is closest. Failing to mention us even once in His signature discussion of the end times can only be explained by the fact that throughout the Olivet Discourse, the Lord was focused on Israel and not the Church. Therefore, any attempt to use this passage in reference to the rapture of the Church requires taking portions of it out of context, and in some cases, a reinterpretation of the text is necessary as well. The Pre-Trib Rapture of the Church remains the only position that is consistent with a literal interpretation of the Scriptures.
You can almost hear the footsteps of the Messiah.
The post Matthew 24 and the Pre-Trib Rapture :: By Jack Kelley appeared first on Rapture Ready.
Anonymous
The rapture is not found in Matt. 24.
Matt. 24, Luke 21 and Mark 13 are all about ethnic national Israel in the tribulation, her time of Jacob’s trouble, not about the Church.
The Church is a mystery (Eph. 3) being revealed beginning at Pentecost. The Church is unknown in the OT and practically unknown in the Gospels. The Gospels are a record of Jesus fulfilling the first 69 weeks of Daniel’s prophecy.
We cannot drag the OT or the Gospels into the Church.
We must discern the authorial intent and then seek to make practical application.
Anonymous
Duane L Burgess Terry Wiles good job – is this also the stance you subscribe to? Oscar Valdez Peter Vandever not just the rapture BUT Charles Page Link Hudson Brett Dobbs and perhaps even Kyle Williams are YET to show ANY resurrection(s) in MT 24 and this may even count for @everyone in this here group !
Anonymous
Troy Day weren’t you the one who believed in a resurrection at that time vases on the book of Daniel?
Anonymous
Link Hudson did you NOT read what the article says on Daniel?
Anonymous
Troy Day I don’t knownif O read it or not. Isn’t on my screen.bif you tag me I usually reply to that message. I don’t read everything on the forum.
Anonymous
Link Hudson it is said that you dont know but still claim to know Are you agreeing with Charles Page that there are NO female angels?
Anonymous
Troy Day, there are no female angels in the Bible.
Anonymous
Troy Day This is true. In every church I consistently show that Matthew 24 is not about the church but ISREAL in the Tribulation. So many fallacies would be cleared up if Christians would apply Matt. 24 in the right context.
Anonymous
Duane L Burgess in Ephesians 3 is Paul saying that the mystery is the church? Or is Paul saying that the mystery that was hidden in old time, was that the messiah would come as a servant and die for the sins of the world. (Technically I guess that is still a mystery since you only believe Christ died for the elect). And that through Jesus’s crucifixion that the gentiles would be grafted into the promise that was only made to Israel.
The thing that Dispensationalist overlooked is that they think there is some kind of distinction between national Israel and a gentile church. The church is true Israel. It’s not replacing Israel. God made a distinction in the new covenant, that only those who have faith in him will be his people. Instead of his people being mixed group of believers and non believers.
But cutting off the unbelieving branches out of the olive tree (Israel) he did this in order for them to come back in through faith. It was actually a merciful thing to do. And as soon as any Hebrew believes, they’re grafted back in.
They’re not cut off or hardened from birth as much as Calvinist and dispensationist try to portray that.
No… they’re only cut off after un belief. Partial given over to the hardness of their heart because of their unbelief.
It’s not that complicated. Dispensationalism and Calvinism muddies up right theology. Take off those lenses and read what the text says. And stop reading into the text things that the text doesn’t say.
Anonymous
Bill Lickliter well we AGREE with Duane L Burgess all and while even resurrection is not found in MT24 by Link Hudson Brett Dobbs
Anonymous
Cathe Ferguson Zechariah 5:9
Anonymous
Duane L Burgess you would note Brett Dobbs complete ignores MT24 in his response. The inability to find resurrection there is #SHOCKING Link Hudson is too failing to show resurrection in MT24 and connect it with 1Thes ch4/ch15 making their claims empty of any theology proper!
Anonymous
Troy Day, do “wings” insinuate angels? The word angel is not mentioned.
Anonymous
haha whatever Your cherry picking “theology” is amusing @ best
Anonymous
Troy Day Resurrection after the tribulation:
Daniel 12
1 At that time Michael shall stand up,
The great prince who stands watch over the sons of your people;
And there shall be a 👉time of trouble,
Such as never was since there was a nation,👈
Even to that time.
And at that time your people shall be delivered,
Every one who is found written in the book.
2 And many of those who 👉sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake,👈
Some to everlasting life,
Some to shame and everlasting contempt.
(NKJV)
Matthew 24
. 21 For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be.
Revelation 2:22 and 7:14 also mention the great tribulation.
Compare with Revelation 20, after the appearance of the Rider on the white horse in chapter 19.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is 👉the first resurrection.
This is presented right after the event at the end of Revelation 19, which I think we can all agree refers to the Second coming. In Revelation 19, we also see the Beast thrown into the lake of fire.
Revelation 19
20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.
Paul tells us the lawless one will be destroyed at the coming of the Lord.
II Thessalonians 2:8
8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
The scripture also shows us that the rapture and resurrection occur at the coming of the Lord.
I Thessalonians 4
15 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the 👉coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will 👉rise first. 17 Then we who are alive and remain shall 👉be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord.
Notice that the rapture, resurrection, and destruction of the lawless one occur at Jesus’ coming. The resurrection at the end of the book of Revelation, which describes the ‘great tribulation’ occurs at the end of the book and is called ‘the great tribulation.’
If you disagree with this, please show me scripture that shows that Jesus will rapture His church seven years before His coming or that the man of sin will be destroyed seven years after His coming. You could also show some scripture that shows that a resurrection will take place before the first resurrection, or some scripture to prove the idea that first really means second.
Quotes fare rom the NKJV
Anonymous
Link Hudson I am carefully reading MT24 21 and do NOT in fact see the word resurrection OR any reference to resurrection in it Appears you are mix and matching apples and oranges BTW your people in Daniel clearly points to ISRAEL as Duane L Burgess showed you already quite well
Anonymous
Troy Day we can only understand the word through the help of the holy spirit atherwise you can get lost in the middle of the word and start scaring people like the world is ending tomorrow, it’s a mystery no one knows the hour or the day of his coming, so let’s preach the gospel of faith and salvation and truth
Anonymous
The word rapture is not in the Scripture!
Anonymous
Just read the Genesis 16 chapter and it’s clear today why Christians, Jews, and Muslims are warring today. Abraham and Sarah’s unwillingness to remain faithful in what was promised to them truly begin the issues we see even today. My keyword from the scripture is patience. Hangar’s patience and willingness to be obedient is why the Angel (some believe it could have actually been Jesus) promised her multitudes. We cannot make moves without the Spirit guiding us. Impatience is worst than money when it comes to evil. Ask Adam and Eve.
Anonymous
Abraham Varghese Try again – the very word rapture is in the BIBLE multiple times.
Anonymous
Troy Day
Anonymous
Duane L Burgess the Septuagint class Israel Gods “ekklesia” in the wilderness.
Anonymous
I believe in a pretrib rapture with privileges. As I see it, there are only two places where the rapture is clearly stated in the NT: I Corinthian 15:51-52 and 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18. In none of those places is the topic the rapture. The theme is the resurrection. Therefore, since the rapture is an incident of the resurrection, its location in time depends on the time of the resurrection of the righteous and whether it is punctual or somehow non-punctual. It seems to me that it is very difficult to make a dogmatic determination on this. Now, based on what Craig Blomberg explains, I lean towards pretrib: “No matter what they do, historic premillennialists have a hard sell: going through the tribulation is not nearly as appealing as escaping from it. Years ago, while teaching an adult Sunday school lesson on pre- and posttribulation rapture positions, I was stopped cold in my pedagogical tracks by a class member who exclaimed, “But I really don’t want to go through the tribulation.” Case closed.”
Anonymous
Ferdinand Gonzalez what privileges Brett Dobbs dont know about yet?>
Anonymous
I don’t know about Dobbs, but my privilege is to believe in a pretrib rapture without much ado.
Anonymous
Ferdinand Gonzalez your privilege to believe in a pretrib is right Also Link Hudson Charles Page are privileged to be left behind with Brett Dobbs
Anonymous
Troy Day Worst, we will all be still here with our senseless verbiage!
Anonymous
Charles Page thatS not a real theological statement per se
Anonymous
Christ returned in 70 A D so there is no pre-tribulation rapture of the church and we’ll see Trump reelected and serve two terms before Michelle Obama is elected. Will she be too old to run?
Anonymous
Charles Page well Ricky Grimsley Link Hudson Philip Williams agree !!
Anonymous
Troy Day on what?
Anonymous
who cares?
Anonymous
Troy Day: you show me the word “rapture” in Scripture with reference. Not interpretation. So, I will let you try again.
Anonymous
Abraham Varghese sure AND if I do you would then what… ? I tell you what since you have been a member of my group since 2018 – 5yrs and never said anything until now we will do this
you show me resurrection in MT24
I will show you the word rapture in the BIBLE not any Hindu Scripture
THEN WE will agree you are wrong and backslidden in your theory !
DEAL?
Anonymous
Terry Wiles yes it does Duane L Burgess LXX is just great
Anonymous
Troy Day: NO DEAL. It appears Hindu Scripture knows the Bible better than you. Repent brother, and go study the Scripture!!!!!!
Anonymous
Yes no one knows the day or the hour when the Lord Jesus will call his church home that is why we must warn them not to go to hell.
Anonymous
Essengo Size glad you can only understand the word through the help of the Spirit
Anonymous
The rapture is the ascension that’s happening now
Anonymous
Zachariah Ana see Charles Page ?
Anonymous
Ken Van Horn My view is simple: Treat the Scriptures the same Jesus did, otherwise you aren’t following Christ? How did Jesus treat the GOSPELS?