Click to join the conversation with over 500,000 Pentecostal believers and scholars
Click to get our FREE MOBILE APP and stay connected
Peter A Vandever | PentecostalTheology.com
Jesus drank wine. I knew a man who said the disciples were probably so sleepy in the garden because they’d had four cups of red wine. If they’d eaten a whole lamb, too, just think how full and sleepy they would have been.
Our food affects how sleepy we feel or how energized we feel. That’s not necessarily some kind of sinful thing. Of course, someone could take a drug to get high, but I don’t see how drinking a tea that relaxes you or peps you up a little but doesn’t interfere with your judgment is sinful.
I don’t know much about kava, though. Is it stronger stuff than I am aware of?
Link Hudson [09/02/2015 3:51 PM]
When I was in Indonesia, I heard of a preacher who preached against eating tape (pronounce ta-pe, two syllables), fermented casava. Now, it does have small amounts of alcohol in it. Indonesians use it in a dessert, and it’s a bit like putting essence of rum in something. I’ve never heard of anyone getting drunk off of tape.
But I heard the same preacher had no problem with people eating durian. Durian is a large spikey fruit with a pungent odor. The skin is thick but there is a kind of creamy bit of flesh around the seeds that people eat. It’s a delicacy in southeast Asia, though it is an acquired taste for others. The TV show Fear Factor used to make challenge people to eat it along with animal guts and bugs. Durian ferments just a little. Indonesians let children eat it, too. The alcohol content is low, especially if a whole family shares a durian. I have heard of someone getting a little drunk off of eating five or ten durians.
David Lewayne Porter
Gee, who was around back then to tell us for sure, 🙂
Louise Cummings
I don’t believe it was alcoholic drinks because when Jesus turned the water into wine. The BIBLE SAID WHEN THEY HAD WELL DRANK. They run out and you know the story of His Mother telling Him they were out of wine. He turned Water into wine. The point of my story is if they would have already well cranked before Jesus made Water wine. They would have been drunk or passed out. They wouldn’t have known the last was better than the first. Or not. Because they would have been to drunk. My opinion. ( also He said touch not , taste not that which is to perish with the using. ). Also He said be not drunk with wine. Where in is excess. But be Filled. With The Spirit. And Scriptures in The Old Testament in some places. They called grape juice wine. That’s my feeling about it.
Varnel Watson
David Lewayne Porter It takes a while for some people to recognize that real Biblical holiness cannot be lived while drinking Brody Pope Alan
Varnel Watson
Question is it possible to be sanctified and spend 3 hours watching football? When you know they will be promoting alcohol and using sexual promiscuity to sell products.
And you know there will be lies and arrogance?
Is it a deliverance to be sought and enjoyed? A freedom from fake manliness? Joe Absher Link Hudson Melvin Harter Scotty Searan
Link Hudson
I do not watch football so I am not familiar with recent ads.
I do nit consoider a beer ad to be inherently.sinful necessarily, though some may seek to arouse sexual lust. That is a problem. Do the ads encourage excess of beer?
Is it sinful to have a hobby? To engage in social activities with friens?
Varnel Watson
I have witnessed SAT night pastors watch sport game OR even MMA till past midnight having a brew or two or more than a few – then get up SUN am to preach with fresh anointing #shame
Link Hudson
Troy Day why did u hang out with them?
Did they preach against drinking in moderation or have a weak conscience about it?
Varnel Watson
Bible college? – cant leave after curfew
Scotty Searan
Troy Day, Link Hudson
We like to quote Psalms 100
Not many quote from Psalms 101
3 I will set no wicked thing before mine eyes: I hate the work of them that turn aside; it shall not cleave to me.
I don’t watch football either, because of the ads,Cheerleaders and the craziness of the fans.
This made me think of a comment made by youngest son watching TV.
He came running in the bedroom “Daddy, daddy those ladies with the pretty legs is dancing.” He was about 5 years old and he had picked up on me watching the ladies legs.
He was talking about the Rockettes
I had to do some repenting. I also talked to my boys alsp
David Griffin
Link Hudson to answer your questions. In my personal opinion it is not a sin to have a hobby if that hobby is not destructive, i.e. fly fishing or tying flies, collecting stamps ect. Engaging in social activities with friends is a good thing, dancing, bowling, dinner, going on a picnic, having a get together for a BBQ, trail hiking, camping, taking a trip on a vacation, sightseeing, ect. As long as the activity is wholesome. Let your conscience be your guide. Or if you are a spiritual person, let the Holy Ghost becypur guide.
David Griffin
Sanctification means to be separate from evil. The Lord has commanded that we sanctify ourselves.
Link Hudson
David Griffin Is entertainment evil? Back in the old days, a lot of Pentecostals from Holiness movement backgrounds were against ‘wordly entertainment.’ So what is worldly? Square dancing? drinking beer? Football? Does the Bble have to say something negative about it for us to consider it to be worldly?
IMO, football is a good sport NOT to support because of the health consequences of concussions. There are injuries in soccer and basketball, but it’s not the same. Overall, these sports are good exercise. Boxing would be another good sport not to watch, along with some of the more extreme fighting shows.
David Griffin
Link Hudson Entertainment in itself is not evil
There is evil entertainment.
I precieve that you are an intelligent man and already know the difference.
If you choose to be entertained by evil that’s your choice. But, we have a choice. We can choose wholesome uplifting entertainment. If you do not or cannot make a choice, pray and ask Heavenly Father.
Your conscience and the Holy Ghost will let you know the difference.
Link Hudson
David Griffin I do not care for football, but I wouldn’t condemn someone for watching it. I wouldn’t accuse someone of being unsanctified for watching three hours of it. Too much watching football is not good stewardship of time in most cases, IMO. But someone could use watching football as a bridge for building relationships, evangelism, etc.
Varnel Watson
Maybe just maybe they can even preach on it; which is not Scotty Searan testimony in this case
Link Hudson
Troy Day Sports analogies in sermons get old quick if you aren’t into it. I got tired of a Canadian pastor talking about hockey.
Joe Absher
Men are born for passion. Its in our DNA to strive and compete to succeed and achieve. Some however are mere distractions and petty thieves. If time is the greatest gift (in the natural) then giving it away could easily be the greatest investment. Question is what or who do you give your time to? A few hours in the wilderness or time spent on heavens table land.
I’ve seen it people will come to church on Sunday morning and asking where is the love? where’s God? He didn’t leave you, you left him. Spending God’s money on violence and yelling kill him on Saturday night and praying God heals him on Sunday morning. Where’s your God? You left him at the altar of Baal last night.
Varnel Watson
Link Hudson Paul said life is much like wrestling
Joe Absher
And killing
Varnel Watson
David comment?
Cindy Fox
Gentleman, We should wholly rely on THE WORD OF GOD along with it’s illumination by THE POWER OF THE HOLY SPIRIT,to guide ALL our choices, we should not rely on: man made culture,not our own conscience,not our heart,not what our pastor says,not what the overseer says,not our desires,but on THE LIFE GIVING WORD OF GOD working through us by the HOLY SPIRIT because we have gained access by THE BLOOD OF THE LAMB ,PERIOD !!!!!!!!!!!!
Scotty Searan
Jeremiah 17:9 King James Version (KJV)
9 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?
Cindy Fox
Amen brother
Varnel Watson
Jesus Christ was a Jew. He would never partake of a pagan drink that would affect His clear mind or that would have a medicine-like affect if He was not sick. There are other ways to rest without doing this. He spent time teaching the prostitutes, publicans and others the greatness of His Fathers Kingdom, not just chilling with them. Too many try to justify a lot of activity by attaching their imaginary Jesus to it.
Link Hudson
Troy Day Pagan drink? Read your Bible. The Torah told the priests to pour out drink offerings. The Bible says God brings forth food from the earth– wine to make men’s hearts merry. Deacons are not to drink __much__ wine. But Paul told Timothy to drink a little wine.
Doesn’t it feel like you are being dishonest with yourself when you have to strain on re-interpreting obvious scriptures to fit with church tradition?
Varnel Watson
Link I;ve shown you the greek on all of these It’s pretty clear non-drinking is a requirement
Link Hudson
Troy Day That’s silly. Why do so many people who read Greek, including the Greeks, disagree with you? Did no one really understand Greek at all until the temperance movement?
Varnel Watson
the Greeks are drunks and the Cretans – Paul says it in the Bible Their national sport is drinking and eating
Link Hudson
Troy Day Where does it say that? I am familiar with the verse about Cretans being liars.
Jews also drink wine. Do you think Jesus drank non-kosher wine at Passover?
Varnel Watson
Titus 1:12, “One of themselves, a prophet of their own, said, “Cretans are always liars, evil beasts, lazy gluttons.” -0 Epimenides, a native either of Phæstus or of Cnossus in Crete, the original author of this line, which is also quoted by Callimachus. Epimenides is here called a prophet, not simply as a poet, but from his peculiar character as priest, bard, and seer; called by Plato θεῖος ἀνήρ and coupled by Cicero with Bacis the Boeotian prophet, and the sibyl (Bishop Ellicott); described by other ancient writers as a prophet
Link Hudson
Where are the Greek drunks in that?
Joe Absher
Alcohol is a curse. It destroys families, ruins morals and subverts the will of a man. Alcohol opens the door to every evil and compromises the spirit of a man. In short stop it.
Many a man went a party where there was booze and woke up in hell.
Varnel Watson
Link Crete was greek and then roman at the time