Click to join the conversation with over 500,000 Pentecostal believers and scholars
Click to get our FREE MOBILE APP and stay connected
Alaina Reilly | PentecostalTheology.com
I want to ask, how many anti-rapture people have ever actually listened to the Scriptural arguments of those who are pro-rapture people? And before you insist that it is not mentioned, it is. The concept as well as the word. But it is mentioned in word in the Greek version. That word is Harpotzo (or Harpatzo). If you didn’t know even that much, then stop thinking so highly of your unstinting on this matter. Just saying it is false is not an acceptable answer. You must refute Scripturally the arguments of these following people. BUT you must also refute them not just with Scriptures but without using your computers or tablets or smart phones or the internet or while wearing sneakers or eating pizza or chocolate or drinking soda as none of these items which are real are mentioned in the Holy Scriptures either.
Lorna Taitano
what part of ” those who are alive and remain shall be CAUGHT UP into the the clouds to MEET the LORD in the AIR” do people Not understand?
Alaina Reilly
1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZH6pSS1tuo&t=2060s
Alaina Reilly
2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j6lEkztZnIs
W Ron Cowart
So does that mean we can’t use our cars? The Bible says we are all in one accord? Sorry bad joke!
Alaina Reilly
3. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9oijiY-dL20
Alaina Reilly
4. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e3T1zpi8F9I&t=3362s
John Destefano
I bet not many
Alaina Reilly
5. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-W2iWGzj7YU&t=4s
Alaina Reilly
6. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oZwiATa50Xg&t=20s
Alaina Reilly
7. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5pvLEZWtYVM&t=80s
Alaina Reilly
8. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cx9PKrvpudU&t=11s
Sean Janusiewicz
Funny then how all these saints missed the so called rapture. Revelation 14:8 A second angel followed the first, declaring: “Fallen, fallen is Babylon the great city! She made all the nations drink of the wine of her immoral passion.”
9 A third angel followed the first two, declaring in a loud voice: “If anyone worships the beast and his image, and takes the mark on his forehead or his hand,
10 that person will also drink of the wine of God’s anger that has been mixed undiluted in the cup of his wrath, and he will be tortured with fire and sulfur in front of the holy angels and in front of the Lamb.
11 And the smoke from their torture will go up forever and ever, and those who worship the beast and his image will have no rest day or night, along with anyone who receives the mark of his name.”
12 This requires the steadfast endurance of the saints – those who obey God’s commandments and hold to their faith in Jesus.
13 Then I heard a voice from heaven say, “Write this: ‘Blessed are the dead, those who die in the Lord from this moment on!'” “Yes,” says the Spirit, “so they can rest from their hard work, because their deeds will follow them.”
Alaina Reilly
O.K. Every one. When you reply, 1. show who you are contesting, 2. where in their video you are contesting, 3. What Scriptures they use that you disagree with and 4.Your own Scriptural defense in in favor of A. no Rapture or of a B. post Trib or C. mid trib or of a D. pre wrath rapture.
Alaina Reilly
Don’t bother to answer if you’ve not listened to any of the videos posted here.
Sean Janusiewicz
I won’t be listening to any post only scripture for me.
Revelation 20:4 Then I saw thrones and seated on them were those who had been given authority to judge. I also saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of the testimony about Jesus and because of the word of God. These had not worshiped the beast or his image and had refused to receive his mark on their forehead or hand. They came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.
Travis Halleck
You want a real paradigm shift, I mean a real paradigm shift?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jaqaGGRg9Yw&t=577s
Craig Colburn
Rapture is FULLY a Jesuit heresy.
Roberto Barba
Very well put. I personally think many confuse rapture with one the ressurections.
But that debate has become redundant here.
You are right, we are instructed to back up every debate with scripture.
Postlewait Kathleen
Since the Rapture comes AFTER the Resurrection it is definitely is part of it. The DEAD IN CHRIST SHALL RISE FIRST, then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up…..
1 Thes. 4
16
For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise (Resurrection) first:
17
Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up (Raptured) together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
Eryd Skeer
He he. There are posts here that aren’t worth a response folks.
Eryd Skeer
Folks,at this rate,one notices that this group does not really to live to the expectations of those who thirst for truth.
I thought the banner here is “end times truth”. Why allow stuff that are never biblical? Does this group entertain falsehood?
Greg Bowman
Jim Eunice
1) Rapture timetables are not criteria for salvation. 2) I have not found a timetable for rapture in black & white , “2+2=4” wording. 3) Hopefully it is mid-trib. or post-trib. so we can fight on and not be “running in the face if the enemy.” 4) Hope for the best,but prepare accordingly, since no one can really prove any timetable. This means store food, water, medical supplies, weapons, ammo.
Grady Henley
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JXAkVGr50oo and that is not as fast as the event will take place. had I made the video I would not have used Mat. 24:27, but the event will take place.
Steve Snyder
Rapture is real biblical truth only deception is in timing
William Davis
The “rapture” is true in the meaning of carried away, BUT most World religions either believe in a pre-trib. or a secret rapture which are Both False
Steve Snyder
https://youtu.be/B7103iw2WSg
Charles Meek
What Is (Was) the Rapture?
While there is room for disagreement among Christians on eschatology, I am going to describe very briefly here a different view of the rapture that will shock most evangelical Christians. But I believe it is honoring to God’s word. I ask the reader not to dismiss this out of hand. Check it out against Scripture. Test all things (1 Thessalonians 5:21).
Let’s carefully analyze 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18, the most important passage on the rapture. There are three critical words in this passage: HARPAZO (“rapture”), AER (“air”), and APANTESIS (“meet”). The word HARPAZO does not necessarily mean physical removal. It can mean “to seize on, claim for one’s self.” An interesting example of another use of HARPAZO in the New Testament is 2 Corinthians 12:2-6. Paul tells how he was “caught up [HARPAZO] to the third heaven.” We do not know exactly what happened in this experience; perhaps he was in a trance (Acts 10:9; 22:17). But we do know that Paul remained on earth to tell the story. The term “caught up” in these contexts is closer to what we might say, “I was so caught up in the novel that I saw myself in the story.”
Interestingly, there are two words for “air” in Greek—AER and OURANOS. OURANOS means the upper atmosphere, while AER mean the lower atmosphere, thus the air that we breathe. Paul specifically used AER in this passage. AER may have a spiritual connotation (see Ephesians 2:2). Your feet don’t have to leave the ground to be in the AER.
When Paul said Christians would “meet” (APANTESIS) the Lord in the air, this means the exact opposite of what modern rapturists think. The destination is earth! The Greek word APANTESIS is found in only two other places in the New Testament. In Acts 28:15, believers from Rome went out to “meet” Paul and escort him back to their city. Similarly, in Matthew 25:1-10, the virgins went out to “meet” the bridegroom and escort him back to the wedding hall. Thus, the image evoked in 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17 is that of believers being spiritually caught up to go out to meet and escort Jesus back to earth to begin his rule on earth. The idea of believers being physically transported to heaven in a literal rapture is foreign to the text.
Many Christians think that the purpose of the rapture is to escape the Great Tribulation. But Jesus made it clear that the tribulation was close to them in time in the first century—and matched perfectly the events surrounding the destruction of Jerusalem in AD 66-70 (Matthew 24; Mark 13; Luke 21). Jesus told his first-century readers that they could escape the tribulation by retreating to the mountains!
One cannot read 1 Thessalonians 4 and miss the fact that Paul was teaching that the events he was describing would HAPPEN TO HIS CONTEMPORARIES. It would make no sense to the Thessalonians for Paul to be describing events that would happen thousands of years later. This time-line would be consistent with Jesus’ numerous “this generation” prophecies, including Matthew 10:23; 16:27-28; 29-34; 26:64; etc.
Did Jesus ever say anything about a rapture? Actually, Jesus prayed against any rapture in the sense of physical removal! In John 17:15 we see his prayer to the Father, “I do not pray that You should take them out of the world, but that You should keep them from the evil one.” If Jesus asked for such, would the Father deny his request?
So, what was the “rapture?” Honoring both the biblical time-texts and careful exegesis of the text, it was Jesus coming “in judgment” in AD 70 to bring the Old Covenant order to a close, to claim believers as his own, and to be with us forever. This is great news, don’t you think?
For more, see my complete article on this:
https://onedrive.live.com/?authkey=%21APS0XlpV5BkPPiA&cid=D3BD424B0B25B83F&id=D3BD424B0B25B83F%2116793&parId=D3BD424B0B25B83F%21113&o=OneUp
David Ortiz
The timing of the catching up is after the 6th bowl of wrath is poured out as Jesus said in Revelation 16 “Behold I come as a thief. The dean in Christ are raised on the last day, and when this mortal puts on immortality on that same last day, death is defeated being the last enemy to be put down. Pre rapture is a deception as it will guarantee the believer in it will say the Lord delayeth his return when a pre rapture does not take place falling away in disillusionment becoming offended, having no oil, no armour, and did not build their life on a rock that endures a flood of tribulation. They did not prepare. Jesus clearly said, Father DO NOT take those that believe in me out of the world, but Keep them from the evil. We can listen to the words of Jesus, or we can continue to be bewitched with the only concern of self evaporation deception.
Eryd Skeer
Since some of us can’t post in the group because according to the admin we should NOT post what we know,it is only fair some us of leave the group..adieus!
Eryd Skeer
Thanks for having accepted me in the group.
Thanks so much
Mike Brotherton
The rapture speaks to our redemption. For the whole creation groans for the redemption of our body.
Paul Bortolazzo
Anyone denying the gathering of the dead in Christ and alive believers at His coming is denying the second coming of Christ
Mike Brotherton
Why most of us long for the rapture
Romans 8:22-24
22 We know that the whole creation has been groaning as in the pains of childbirth right up to the present time. 23 Not only so, but we ourselves, who have the firstfruits of the Spirit, groan inwardly as we wait eagerly for our adoption to sonship, the redemption of our bodies. 24 For in this hope we were saved. But hope that is seen is no hope at all. Who hopes for what they already have?
It is in our DNA. At least most of us.
Mike Brotherton
https://www.facebook.com/groups/938288939701278/?hc_location=group
Marian Alexi Hayden
I have heard scrioutes on both sides so I ‘m sitting on the fence and just seeing
Nucchi Calicura
There’s only a 1st resurrection and 2nd resurrection, pray your in the 1st. This is very helpful, ” One Thousand years- The Millennium” Kenneth Cox, youtube
William Gwynn
I want to ask how many have listened to the truth-sense of His indwelt Presence, trumping ANY and EVERY counter argument?
I’ll go out on a limb and say, perhaps 1% of you; but then, if you knew what He said, you’d understand that spiritual understanding does not come through a battle of carnal egos.
Like Peter knowing that Jesus Christ was the Son of God BEFORE Jesus taught ANY of His disciples that Truth, so too should be our own sense of understanding, a personal download from above.
These debates are hotbeds of ego, division and hatred…
More should be pressing in and asking Himself, to teach about Himself instead of seeking flesh to teach about the Spirit.
The flesh will refuse the Spirit, because the flesh is at war with the Spirit.
The Spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak. Let your old natures die and live in Him.
A Spiritual mind understands, but to a carnal mind, what I’ve typed is foolishness
So, when a spiritual Truth is taught, a carnal mind will insist they know more than the Spirit. A spiritual mind is subjected to the Living Word, Jesus Christ, and abiding in the Word in obedience.
The carnal mind is always seeking another way. There is Only One. If you aren’t seeking Him, you’re wrong.
Sean Janusiewicz
As long as we love our God the hevenly creator above all else and love our neighbor as ourselves then none of this matters.
Robert Hunt
https://ruready.blog/2019/11/30/for-those-who-say-there-will-be-no-rapture/
William Gwynn
I will listen to only my Father. Are you saying this man knows more than the Lord Mr. Hunt?
Grace Williams
I’ve listened and studied both sides. I am a rapture believer. I’m I sick of hearing the word isn’t mentioned, the word Trinity isn’t either.
Cheri Evans
Tons
Paul Bortolazzo
‘But now Christ is risen from the dead, and has become the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep. For since by man came death, by Man also came the resurrection of the dead.’ 1 Corinthians 15:20-21
The first resurrection has four phases. (1 Cor. 15:20-21, 22-23, Rev. 20:4; 21:24) Adam’s sin brought spiritual and physical death. (Gen. 3:14-19) This is why God provided a way for His creation to become spiritually alive again. Our Father sent His Son to die for our sins and defeat death. (1 Cor. 15:3, Rom. 5:12-21) Jesus was the first to rise from the dead and live forevermore. The Christ is the firstfruits of the first resurrection. (1 Cor. 15:20-21)
‘For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ all shall be made alive. But each one in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, afterward those who are Christ’s at His coming…’ 1 Corinthians 15:22-23
The second phase is the resurrection of the dead in Christ and the translation of alive believers. (1 Thes. 4:16-17, Mark 13:26-27) Old and New Testament believers will be made alive at His Second Coming. (1 Cor. 15:22-23, 50-52)
‘… And they lived and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.’ Revelation 20:4b
The third phase is those martyred by the Beast. During the Great Tribulation, many will suffer death for the sake of His name. They will be raised incorruptible and reign with Christ on the first day of His thousand-year reign. (Rev. 12:11; 20:4b; 21:9-10)
‘And the nations of those who are saved shall walk in its light, and the kings of the earth bring their glory and honor into it.’ Revelation 21:24
There will be believers living among the nations when the Lamb and His bride descend within the Holy Jerusalem. (Rev. 21:9-10) During His 1,000-year reign, they will be able to enter through the gates of the holy city. (Rev. 22:14) Every believer living on a new earth will eventually join His wife. (Rev. 22:1-5) All in Christ shall be made spiritually alive for eternity. (1 Cor. 15:22) Blessed are those the second death has no power over. (Rev. 2:11) This will be the final phase of the first resurrection. (Rev. 21:24-27)
Kim Rawson
For one, there are only 2 resurrections……and Jesus is the firstfruits does not make that the first resurrection of the saints…..Christ rose from the dead and He is the life and the resurrection……the first fruits are the dead in the Lord……then those who are alive when He comes are caught up together with them to meet the Lord in the air….that is called the first resurrection……….the next resurrection is of the wicked and that is after the thousand years……that is called the second resurrection and we don’t want to be a part of that one cus they are cast into hell
Harpon Liwamag
after 1000 year reign of Christ and the first resurrected people , whom there is no more death to them , there will be another resurrection of the dead, these people are part of Christ and 1st resurrected people evangelism to all nation….bec.christ will use iron rod..and after that the devil will be thrown….
Richard Suarez
Christ is part of the firstfruits (plural) of the First Resurrection and so is the 144k Revelation 14:4-5 These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb. (5) And in their mouth was found no guile: for they are without fault before the throne of God. All this about the 144k is in past tense. Were, not are or will be, they are before the throne (past event) Follow the Lamb wherever he goes, didn’t He ascend 2k years ago, so they went with him. Your attempt to spin very clear verses is amusing.