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Is the EUROPEAN UNION the Revised Roman Empire?
Varnel Watson
Link Hudson I was very surprised to learn that there are people within Pentecostalism that do NOT know that #noughsaid
Philip Williams
No, that role must go to America.
David Rollings
Nom there is no evidence for that being the case, only somebody who does not undestand the nature of the EU would post such a silly question
Varnel Watson
imagine that https://www.amazon.co.uk/David-Hathaway-Babylon-Prophecy-European/dp/B00I63JFDQ
David Rollings
Troy Day Why are you reffering me to something by David Hathaway when I have told you in the past that I don’t trust his interpretation of Scripture. I am very suspicious of his ministry.
Varnel Watson
its a common EU interpretation not just his
David Rollings
It might be common in the USA it is not in the UK
Varnel Watson
wasnt John Darby who first stated it?
David Rollings
Troy Day did not Darby live before the EU came about?
Varnel Watson
they all did – well hard to tell actually since the EU idea came about quire early as Revised Roman empire
David Rollings
Troy Day But the EU only came into existence in the 1950’s, so anything pre-dating that can’t be relevant to the subject.
Varnel Watson
they interpreted the 10 kingdoms as some sort of EU and got it pretty right if you ask me – surprised you dont know https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCMgxIB60Vc
David Rollings
Troy Day I don’t find this convincing.
Varnel Watson
you may not but most of Pentecostalism historically has https://www.dakebibleboard.com/viewtopic.php?t=6768
David Rollings
Troy Day Oh dear, this originally appeared on the Babylonian Bee website Which is a satirical website. Therefore this post is entirely a work of fiction having fun at the expense of those who like prophetic charts. Here is the link to the original post, https://babylonbee.com/news/dispensationalists-frantically-adjust-charts-include-brexit-vote/
Varnel Watson
Yes – I was thinking the same when posted it It is so Popular in Pentecostalism that even Babylonian Bee is making fun of it and yet you have never heard of it
Open ANY prophecy chart of the 70s and the 10 kings are written as EU – revised or revived Roman empire
David Rollings
that is because at one point in the 70’s the EU was made up of 10 nations but once that ceased to be the case the arguement soon vonished. I am sorry but is just not credible.
Varnel Watson
Nope – not really. There are many countries in EU today that were NOT part of the Roman Empire As we see many are leaving EU or will be leaving in a few short years Posted you a scholarly paper below to read more about it
Link Hudson
I have heard the theory many times before.
Varnel Watson
If you have not heard the theory many times before you are not Pentecostal or Baptist
Link Hudson
Troy Day I am not sure I ever heard it in the A/G,…probably…but I know I heard it on TV. Swaggart believed in a literal Babylon. I heard pretrib rapture, but some Pentecostal preachers do not go into that much detail on specific theories.
Varnel Watson
A/G promoted it best in the early years but YES it died off around the end of the Cold War just to resurfice again
Mike Albright
Definitely maybe possibly could be.
Varnel Watson
Thank you for clarifying this essential issue
Mike Albright
Troy Day I am absolutely positive that my opinion might or might not be right.
Philip Williams
Compare Pax Romana
with Pax Americana!
Varnel Watson
Pax Romana YES but neither America nor Pax Romana is in the Bible now is it?
Philip Williams
What do you understand as the 4th and terrible beast in Daniel’s vision?
Varnel Watson
whatever the angel explained later on in the book
Philip Williams
Troy Day Correct. Beasts are world dominating governments.
Babylon
Media-Persians
Greeks
Romans
Philip Williams
Which government today was modeled on the Roman Republic and dominates the whole world as no government before in human history?
Varnel Watson
the EU govt – USA resembles more of Egypt with its states or Greece @ best – EU has actual ethnic states within it just like Rome – tough our US assimilation has gone down the drain lately
Philip Williams
Rome was also modeled on Egypt. Why the obliques stands in the Roman forum and on the capital mall in Washington.
Philip Williams
EU doesn’t dominate the world, but the American government dominates the world as no other government in human history.
Philip Williams
It’s power comes from embargo, no buying or selling without it’s approval.
Varnel Watson
American government dominates the world ?
Philip Williams
Troy Day if you lived outside of America you would not have to ask.
Varnel Watson
he seems to be right Alan Smith 🙂
Varnel Watson
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERB74j-UD3Y
Varnel Watson
David Rollings Perry STONE has a series of videos explainng v the historical develpoment of the Dan 2 prophecy among Pentecostals that may help you see where this teaching comes from Lately he says 10 of EU and 10 of OPEC Each leg of Dan 2 image to have a parallel fulfillment like it was under Byzantine Rome https://www.jstor.org/stable/27556764?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents
Varnel Watson
David Rollings
ENVISIONING EUROPE
….
During the twentieth century, from the first stirrings of European
integration, conservative Protestant prophesiers in the United States
became both intrigued and horrified with European developments.
European union both seemed to fulfil prophecy, creating the potential for
the ‘‘ ten nation confederacy,’’ and played on old, evocative, and, in many
respects, anti-Catholic beliefs about Roman power. In the second half of
the twentieth century, the ‘‘new Europe’’ began to figure more
prominently in premillennial writing.
EUROPEAN INTEGRATION
Premillennial interest in European integration is primarily focused upon
the perceived centralisation of power. For the Roman Empire to revive,
a block of co-ordinated, centrally controlled, and regionally amalgamated
power must arise in Europe. Europe must, in effect, become the
overarching superstate feared by eurosceptics generally. According to US
premillennialists, this development is well on its way to occurring.
One of the most influential thinkers on Europe is Hal Lindsey, a
prophecy writer, whose multi-million selling book The Late Great Planet
Earth was published in . The text is in essence a guide to
understanding how the world will end, given events at that time, and
Lindsey’s view, then, was that it would end soon. He discussed a number
of trends, giving specific attention to European developments.
p8 and following here => https://static.cambridge.org/resource/id/urn:cambridge.org:id:binary:20170213064600964-0709:S0021875899006258:S002187589900625Xa.pdf
Varnel Watson
Philip Williams I;ve been outside the States enough to agree with Lindsey when he speaks to the ‘‘EC Game Plan,’’ which includes the following
NNATOmust be destroyed. The defense of Europe will be handled by the Western
European Union.… the powers of Europe will attempt to impose their will on
weaker member states… The president of the EC/EU will
automatically become the president of Europe. … The right to veto will be
scrapped… this will be a real shock to the people of Great Britain… Europe will
adopt a Kruggerand-style gold coin as its standard of currency
Varnel Watson
David Rollings Lindsey speaks of
a real shock to the people of Great Britain
back in 1994 – could current Brexit be fulfillment of the ancient prophecies ?
Philip Williams
Troy Day Well if you got 10 horns you need a beast, and the vastly greater US power led to the formation of the EU, just as the 10 European kings came from the erstwhile Roman Empire.
Varnel Watson
erstwhile Roman Empire.?
vastly greater US power led to the formation of the EU??
Come again pls?
Philip Williams
Troy Day Certainly the EU grew out of the US Marshall plan immediately following WWII and has continued to depend on the shield of the US led NATO. The World Bank is US sponsored and headquartered not in Europe but in Washington, DC.
Varnel Watson
So WWII and Hitlers plan to restore the Roman Empire under one single EU had nothing to do with it? 🙂
Philip Williams
Troy Day interesting, but I suppose there were similar ambitions by the Tzars and Napoleon.
Varnel Watson
read on EU has a very rich history
“This report was written by various bankers and academics and laid out a plan for how Germany would manage the economies of the conquered countries of Europe after a German victory. The report was drawn up under the leadership of Professor Walter Funk the Reich’s Economics Minister and President of the Reichsbank.
“The report contained sections on Agriculture, Industry, Employment, Transport, Trade, Economic Agreements, and Currency. It proposed the ‘harmonisation’ of European currencies and a harmonised currency system.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/eu-referendum-nazis-created-basic-plan-for-the-european-union-ukip-mep-gerard-batten-says-a7032221.html
Philip Williams
The 16th century Spanish King Phillip probably had similar plans as did Louis IV of France. And of course, Napoleon!
Varnel Watson
dont forget Charlemagne
Philip Williams
Troy Day
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bretton_Woods_system
Philip Williams
It’s the American Industrialist and bankers at Bretton Woods explaining to the British that they were going to have to open their colonial markets for free trade. The Americans and only the Americans created this world economic system. Of course for rich Americans and big banks and corporations.
Varnel Watson
it collapsed in the 60s because we had no clue how to run Hitlers economic plan to create and control EU; we also had no clue of the atomic bomb and M16 and had to bring his people to create them for us
ANYHOW my point
IF you are reading this with any sense you cant claim USA designed or created EU with Hitlers gold
7.19(4) – Specific questions: Looted gold: this is a postwar file – compiled mainly between 1945 and
1948 – documenting the investigation into the origin of gold received by the BIS from the Reichsbank
during the war. This investigation, conducted in the name of the Tripartite Gold Commission,
identified 3.7 tonnes of gold received by the BIS as forming part of the gold looted by the Germans
from the Belgian and Netherlands central banks. These 3.7 tonnes were subsequently restituted in full
by the BIS to the TGC under an agreement signed in Washington on 13th May 1948.
General Records: Banking Department and Accounting Section
• List of gold bars received from the Reichsbank during the Second World War
https://www.bis.org/publ/bisp04.pdf
Philip Williams
I know how the economic system works. I actually knew the man who developed the techniques to implement the Marshall Plan that was the basis of the EU. He was a Scotsman. ?
Philip Williams
Ask the North Koreans who runs the world? Ask the Iranians who is the ‘Great Satan.’ ?
Varnel Watson
Philip Williams 6 months before WWII Britain gave Hitler $9-million in gold Czechoslovak gold being stolen by Germany than the Bank of England’s embarrassment – the Bank for International Settlements actually financed Hitler’s war machine
Some of these moneys came from earlier deposition and circulated in Europe after Jacob Schiff, a 33rd degree mason and chairman of the banking house Kuhn, Loeb & Co. gave Lenin and his group $20 million in gold. In 1917, Rothschild, Natan Meyer (Anglo-German financier. Emulation Lodge No. 21.) directed Lenin to replace Kerensky with Trotsky who came along with 300 Jews from New York…
Some of the Russian revolutionists stole the money and run in Europe spreading the gold in banks like the Bank for International Settlements
Anyhow, when in 1945 much of this gold was found stored in Hitlers secret bunkers it was used for the creation of IMF and later the World Bank – simple history lesson
You probably well know that now with the restructuring of EU in 2018 Bank for International Settlements (BIS) and the International Monetary Fund (IMF) will work even more closely together https://www.bis.org/press/p180209a.htm
Philip Williams
Troy Day the IMF was an American creation in Breton Woods, New Hampshire during WWII.
Varnel Watson
yes from July 1 to July 22, 1944 right about when Nazi gold started being shipped over the pond 🙂 This information is straight from from the BIS website
1.3(4) – Report on BIS Operations, 11.1939 – 11.1946.
1.3(5) – Banking Policy of the BIS during the Second World War.
1.19b – Banking Policy of the BIS: Gold Operations, 10.1930 – 12.1967.
1.19c – Banking Policy of the BIS during the Second World War (Art. X of the Hague Agreement).
1.19d – Central Banks of the Baltic States: Gold Deposits / Claims of Baltic nationals, 1940–67.
7.18(5) – Personal papers Paul Hechler (Assistant General Manager of the BIS, 1935-1945): contains
i.a. Hechler’s correspondence with the Reichsbank and thematic files on varied topics such as the
Czech gold affair (March 1939), the Baltic states or the reimbursement of BIS investments in Italy
https://www.bis.org/publ/bisp04.htm
David Rollings
I give up on all this idle, crazy prophetic speculation. It seems to get more bizzare with every addition comment. My European eyes see something very different. I will not be responding to any more comments on this thread
Varnel Watson
so you believe the US started the EU too?
Varnel Watson
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nkkgLJtJtQI