Click to join the conversation with over 500,000 Pentecostal believers and scholars
Click to get our FREE MOBILE APP and stay connected
| PentecostalTheology.com
Megachurch Pastor in Hot Water Again: ‘Christians Are Not Required to Obey Any of the Commandments’ from the OT
Megachurch Pastor Andy Stanley is under fire once again for downplaying the Old Testament and appearing to reject key components of the Christian faith like the Ten Commandments.
Stanley is the senior pastor at the 33,000-member North Point Community Church in Alpharetta, Georgia. Back in May of 2018 he was criticized for saying, “Peter, James, Paul elected to unhitch the Christian faith from their Jewish scriptures, and my friends, we must as well.”
He then said he was misunderstood, saying, “I never suggested we ‘un-hitch’ from a passage of Scripture or a specific biblical imperative.”
Here are Pastor Stanley’s exact words which have sparked a new controversy:
“Participants in the new covenant (that’s Christians) are not required to obey any of the commandments found in the first part of their Bibles. Participants in the new covenant are expected to obey the single command Jesus issued as part of his new covenant: as I have loved you, so you must love one another.”
Tom Steele
If I held a loaded gun to your head and asked you whether or not you believed I should obey the commandment not to commit murder, what would you say?
Robert Erwine
Id say “shoot, shoot, I don’t care “
Jevan Little
The Law of love doesnt murder.
Tom Steele
I would challenge that. I could twist it to say that I am providing an act of love by killing you so you don’t have to suffer in this cursed world any longer and can be eternally with the Father. If we do not need to obey any Biblical commandments except “to love” then we can twist everything else however we want to.
Ray E Horton
Tom Steele Since we are to be Spirit-led in all that we do, that will prevent us from twisting the understanding of God’s will as we obey the commandment of love and not just make fleshly, prideful, weak attempts to obey Old Covenant commandments. It is through the Spirit that God’s love is used to overcome.
Tom Steele
Right… but I was making a point, a point that I felt led by the Spirit to make.
Jevan Little
You could say that, but the bible does not
Jevan Little
For the whole law can be summed up in a single commandment, namely, “ You must love your neighbor as yourself .”
Galatians 5:14 NET
https://bible.com/bible/107/gal.5.14.NET
Tom Steele
The OP proposes that we are not to obey any of the commandments. Your argument says that we are to obey them, just from a different perspective. That the only way to “love God and love your neighbor” is through obeying the commandments. I agree with this, but I am making an argument in line with this notion from the OP that we are not to obey any commandments.
At the end of the day, most Christians believe we are supposed to obey the commandments, but they want to create a loophole so that if they find a commandment they don’t want to obey, they can justify it in their mind.
Louise Cummings
I disagree. He has some kind of point. Or he would have to believe.
Dustin Wilcox
The golden rule sums up the commands. But it takes critical thinking and prayer to apply it to our lives properly.
The bigger problem may be that people don’t want to think or pray deeply, they just want a set of rules to follow to go to Heaven.
Louise Cummings
That , in my opinion is exactly is the thing that would hinder us nor. We get our mind on to many things,to hinder us from seeking Gods Face , is what the Bible tells us to Seek. Is His face. If we tarried at home before God. Students His Word. We could see God move like that.
Dustin Wilcox
Louise Cummings yeah I see what you’re saying. Less free thinking, more Bible thinking. I agree with that.
I guess what I was speaking on was more for applying the love of Christ towards others in our lives. Many people aren’t able to step back from a situation and not get offended by another’s actions. People get offended instead of loving the person for who they are, as Christ would have.
Mark Simmons
All OT law of Moses commandments are repeated in the New Testament. Maybe not in their physical forms, but in a Spiritual form. Jesus even said they were not abolished, but we’re fulfilled. The he proceeded to tell how, after that statement in Matt 5. Ex. Lust isn’t about the physical act only now of adultery, but now if there is a thought…. Murder same way… Then he summed up all the Law in mark 12:30-31. 2 greatest commandment s. Love God above all and with all, and love your neighbor like yourself…. All are repeated.. in NT in it’s full Filled version
Louise Cummings
When they came to Jesus , in the New Testament. Tell us. What is the Greatest Commandments? He said to Love The Lord Thy God with all thy heart , Soul , Mind , Strength. And the second is like into i Thou Shalt Love thy Neighbor as thyself. They said You have answered right. Jesus said. On these Two Commandment. Hangs all the Law and the Prophets. So you could say what the Lord said was sin. Is still sin. The Law was fulfilled in Jesus Christ. He fulfilled the Law to every Jot and title. Now it’s His Blood. His only. That cleansed every sin and stain. There will never have to be another sacrifice. Jesus paid it all. But I believe what He was saying , if you Lobe the Lord Thy God. And your Neighbor. You won’t ever have to worry about committing adultery, lying, sterling. All the sins He said thou shalt not. He nailed them to the tree. Or Cross. We don’t have to worry about those sins any more. Because amen we are washed in His Blood. It kills those desired sins. We will be tempted. But we look to Jesus. And He delivers us. Well I got into more than I meant. It needs a lot more discussion than that. To keep from contradicting ourself. Thank
Mark Simmons
Louise Cummings Matthew 7:23. They got sent away and to damnation because why?? They were lawless, or they broke the laws! Yes, he nailed the sins to the cross and there is no more sacrifice, except Jesus the sacrificial lamb ( OT law requirement fullfillment)
1cor 6:9-10 Paul tells us some examples of old testament law that are still though shall nots or you shall not inherit the Kingdom! All the Law do hang on the two Of love, and yes, if you obey those two you will obey the others. The fullfillment came in the Spirit of righteousness, or right actions.. why, so u will not break the law, but instead you shall obey the Word of Loving which keeps you from breaking the thou shall nots.. they are echoed in every book!
Mark Simmons
It’s not either or, it’s both
Louise Cummings
That is what I was trying to say. Then I thought I needed to bring out some more things. I’ll bring out laser. Almost late for church.
Mark Simmons
Cool. I thought so. Me too. God bless
Varnel Watson
what exactly were yall saying now?
Brian Roden
Someone failed to tell my pastor. He’s 7/10 through a series on the ten commandments
Thangsan Hisfootstep
Just for illustration: a boy is naturally good as long as he obeys his parents. He does not need to try to be good, but he is good. When we obey God by making Jesus Christ as our Savior and Lord, we are good but we don’t keep trying to be good. We are just good. This is how our relationship to those laws and codes as a true believer.
Ray E Horton
The law is for the purpose of showing people they can’t keep it on their own and driving them to their savior, Jesus. And, Jesus upped it to include mental adultery, and anger being equivalent to murder. He wanted to be sure they got it, that they couldn’t keep the commandments on their own. Now, under grace, our spirits have been perfected with the gift of the righteousness of God in Christ. So we no longer focus on the commandments, we focus on Jesus, and godly living is the overflow of that relationship.
Louise Cummings
Jesus paid our debt. Because we couldn’t. We could never keep the Law , perfectly because the Law can’t save you. That would be trying to be saved by works. We are not saved by the works of the LW. But by Grace through Faith. Lest any man could boast. But the Price has been paid , by the Blood Of Jesus. It always took blood. Cain was rejected because it comes through blood. The reason they had to use blood sacrifices. In the Old Testament. But animal blood. Could not save them. It was excepted , until the next year. They had to do it sham. But The perfect Lamb Of God , not born of the seed of a man. But s woman as the Holy Ghost moved upon her and she was conceived by the Hold Spirit. As it moved upon her. The perfect Lamb Of God. Was conceived and was born of The Holy Ghost. And died. Because He said. Without the shedding of Blood. There is no remission of our sin. So Jesus. Paid the price. Got us if we believe in Him. Now it takes believing in Him.
Louise Cummings
That’s true also. With a lot of people.
Varnel Watson
I dont think he is charismatic either Link Hudson
Ray E Horton
The New Covenant way of overcoming the flesh by grace through faith is only successful when we walk after the spirit rather than the flesh. Many do not understand this, therefore are hung up on the O.C. way of keeping the commandments, which can never be successful. Paul addressed this clearly: “Are you so foolish? Having begun in the Spirit, are you now being made perfect by the flesh?” (Gal. 3:3).
Varnel Watson
What do you think about all this Isara Mo ?
Isara Mo
Troy Jesus said He didnt come to abolish(annul) the Law but to FULFILL IT..
The Bible says somewhere that God would write THE LAWS IN THEIR HEARTS IN THOSE DAYS…(New Convenant).
So logically the laws are already IN our hearts NOW rather than in our minds as they used to be were in the OT (my view).
Our ability to obey the laws now is not in our self effort but the empowerment supplied by God through Christ and the leadership of the Holy Spirit..
I think the situation is more complex and serious now than it used to be because God has now put a spiritual law tracking system in a human heart which triggers an alert and a rectification program….It no longer about self effort but partneship, obedience or disobedience depends on attaching oneself to the vine: by yourselves you can do NOTHING Jesus said, which I can say mans self effort to obey or disobey the laws of God is meaningless, useless but it all depends on God.
Grace is an empowerment by God on man to fulfil His purpose.
If in the past people failed to obey the law….when it was OUTSIDE how much more now when it is inside.
It is by GRACE ONLY.
In the past one has to be caught in an act of adultery to be guilty of an offense, but Jesus in fulfilling this law, in the New Convenant said one lustful look at a woman was enough evidence to send one to hell(i guess all the men will go to hell by this….) : can any normal human man restrain his eyes from watching a beautiful lady using his own effort?(possibly blind men…blessed are they because they wont commit tne offense).
Anger might lead to murder so Jesus in saving a human soul from committing murder, said anger is enough to convict one of murder…
It is evident that we cannot obey the laws of God by self effort..it is impossible.
If someone says ” we need not obey the laws any longer” i believe that he has in mind the grace remedy…that only by grace can man obey Gods laws…
Varnel Watson
well I was gonna stay out of this one since I know the man but our propose an interesting point Isara How would you defend his position on what he said? Was he misunderstood?
Jevan Little
Till all be fulfilled…
Varnel Watson
Thanks for your comment but what does it mean?
Isara Mo
Troy Day I think the man said in a few words what i said in so many words…I think he was misunderstood because logically GRACE is not licence to sin but facilitation to “do” the law.
The law still stands(dont stone me for saying so) and is perfected that you cannot avoid it…
God said He will write His laws in their hearts(in this new convenant).He did not say He will ABOLISH His laws..
Troy i think the man didnt mean that we can now lie and cheat and kill and go away with it…I think he meant these things( laws) are still there but it is God who enables us to observe them….to fulfil them not our self effort.
Isara Mo
Jevan Little All is ALREADY FULFILLED I GUESS
Varnel Watson
easy to guess hard to make theology
Jevan Little
Isara Mo jesus didnt say till all prophesies are fulfilled. He was talking about his final act of fulfillment of the law by his death for sins
Jevan Little
For truly I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not one tiny letter or one stroke of a letter will pass away from the law until all takes place.
Matthew 5:18 LEB
https://bible.com/bible/90/mat.5.18.LEB
Isara Mo
Jevan Little Thanks Jevan for clarification.
We sometimes respond as the comments stand
Isara Mo
Troy Day Thanks .It is really easy to guess..but really hard..very hard to make theology..
Varnel Watson
Todd Tomasella whats your take on this here daily issue ?
Todd Tomasella
Knowing and loving Christ leads us to keep His Word. John 14:15-23; 1 John 2:3-6; Matt 2:37-39
Varnel Watson
True meaning of grace vs law bondage of will