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There has been alot of interest in a prophecy that was given at Azusa Street in 1907 about the “Latter Glory.” In order to be biblical, it must be judged by the prophets.
John Kissinger [12/02/2015 2:12 PM]
110 years series beginning in Feb. 2016 on http://cupandcross.com/diamonds-in-the-rough-and-ready-pentecostal-series/
Peter A Vandever [12/02/2015 2:15 PM]
Series? Not sure what this has to do with the 1907 prophetic word?
John Kissinger [12/02/2015 2:17 PM]
A lot – just look and you will see. I would love to take you on it later but for right now I’ll just say that you’ll be dead wrong if you go against Pentecostal restoration. After all even Charles Page page went back to primitivism š http://www.amazon.com/Pentecostal-Primitivism-Preserved-Donev-D-Min/dp/1477557539
Peter A Vandever [12/02/2015 2:19 PM]
Linkbait it is lol
Link Hudson [12/02/2015 3:11 PM]
Did someone call me? I don’t agree that God is never into heritage. In the Old Testament, there are repeated reminders about God calling Israel out of Egypt. Every year, the Israelites were to have festivals where they would live in booths, eat unleavened bread, etc. which reminded every generation of the Exodus. Purim remembered the events of Esther. Jesus went to the festival of lights, which remembered the purifying of the temple during the intertestamental period.
I do think there is a place for heritage. But we are to ‘contend for the faith which was once delivered to the saints’ and Jesus said to teach what He had commanded. So the heritage we should really look at is Biblical heritage, and we can appreciate aspects of history along the way. Restoring Azusa Street isn’t enough.
Peter A Vandever [12/02/2015 3:14 PM]
Remembering what God has done and trying to return to where you have been is two different matters.
John Kissinger [12/02/2015 3:40 PM]
A church which has lost its memory of the past
can only wander aimlessly in the present
and despair in its futureā
~ John A. Sims
Peter A Vandever [12/02/2015 3:41 PM]
Where did I say lose sight of the past? Nowhere.
John Kissinger [12/02/2015 3:45 PM]
Acts 1:6 “Then they gathered around him and asked him, “Lord, are you at this time going to restore…” hm let’s see here: seems Pentecost as a restoration is the never ending topic of Acts and the New Testament
John Kissinger [12/03/2015 8:28 AM]
apart from this old video I really did not find much on the subject https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdD2RfcJXp0
John Kissinger [12/03/2015 8:31 AM]
obviously disregarding the Tommy Welchel telling it – BTW did you hear Tommy Welchel in person or just saw the interviews?
Peter A Vandever [12/03/2015 8:32 AM]
I met him a few years ago. Good guy but I have my questions about the prophetic word… that I pointed out.l
John Kissinger [12/03/2015 8:33 AM]
So I remember when it came out around 2009-2010 but I dont understand why the interest today? It’s already beyond past and BTW many claim Frank Bartleman was the one who prophesied the 100 year renewal
John Kissinger [12/03/2015 8:38 AM]
Oh and how can we miss the Liardon cover version: In 1909, after the initial 1000 day glory outpouring in Azusa street, W. Seymour prophesied that God would restore the glory in 100 years. It would take 100 . http://wn.com/william_j_seymour_charles_parham_great_azusa_street_revival
Peter A Vandever [12/03/2015 9:09 AM]
The prophecy as I understand was “about 100 years” and that could be anything from Toronto onward.
John Kissinger [12/03/2015 9:12 AM]
well since we’re now abut 110 yrs…
Varnel Watson
coming soon to a city near you Peter Vandever Joe Absher
Joe Absher
Good old Link . Is he still in Joktara ?
Peter Vandever
I question this prophecy
Varnel Watson
I have no reason to question it Except the 100 yrs have already past We all well know the prophecy was given to Bartleman trough his wife and transmitted in his publications HOWEVER most historians have overlooked it because of his wife’s origin and we are left only with the spectacle commentators who would include it on occasions
Varnel Watson
Peter Vandever ADAPT? to what ā worldly morals and values in a corrupt and failing system of SIN? JESUS never adapted He LED culture ā a left behind church will still be saying we need to adapt after the real church is grabbed away Steve Losee
A small virus shut down most churches in the world and they are so crippled they can hardly open again HOW is such a weak church open during the Tribulation and save soul? No cant do
(1) for starters: ONLY the ones who take the mark of the Beast (whoever that may be) will not be able to buy or sell. Anything! Food, gas, electricity, water ā absolutely nothing.
(2) The pastors will NOT be able to receive salaries, insurance or anything included in their package. Remember, if the church cannot buy or sale, neither can the pastor receive a salary. And even if a salary is given, what would the pastor spend it on without the mark of the beast?
(3) Tithing system ā those are most usually set up with a paper check or some sort of electronic banking like debiting or crediting. With the mark of the beast, the church will NOT be able to receive those moneys and even if it does, it cannot operate with them to buy or sell anything.
(4) What about church buildings ā without the mark of the beast they will not be able to purchase any service ā electricity, lights, internet, gas for church vans, insurance, special events, catering, food ā no communion elements. Nothing at all. With no professional services available, a church building may last a few months, but will fall apart soon before the Tribulation is overā¦ Just think about it
(5) Any other church related logistics or operations that depend on the purchase of gasoline and transportation. They way current church infrastructure in America is set up, how many would actually take the time to walk miles and miles to a church?
Anonymous
This topic as we discussed it back in 2015 Tommy Smith https://www.facebook.com/pentecostaltheology/posts/pfbid0VdwnzvoVcci2irweiUuMVs1EQGUpmZEjcK7KFC2YanxdUFaivpJDrsQ5KVLtTvjhl
Troy Day
Peter Vandever topic from 7yrs ago Philip Williams Link Hudson @tommy smith https://www.pentecostaltheology.com/?s=aZUSA+prophecy
Troy Day
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdD2RfcJXp0
Troy Day
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdD2RfcJXp0
Troy Day
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdD2RfcJXp0
Troy Day
Michael Chauncey Peter Vandever I think it was Jerome Herrick Weymouth who said
This sounds about just what I heard preached back in the early 1970’s (except for where the location- we were believing it would start here in the Western Hemisphere.)
I do not disagree and I do appreciate Link Hudson Tommy Smith trying to explain this movement. I am a bit puzzled by the titles āMessenger of the Third Pentecostā AND the other few titles mentioned though I do remember the reminiscent of Azusa @ SPS a few years back https://sps-usa.org/download/programs/program_2006.pdf
Troy Day
we now have 3rd exodus too HobbyLink Japan Ricky Grimsley BUT not by the boat Philip Williams found https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JxDAehnPprs
Troy Day
I think Norris is dead WRONG Link Hudson Peter Vandever Bishop G. Wesley Hardy Bishop Bernie L Wade NOT only the cloud lifted but it reached the WORLD How else did it get to Asia if it never lifted? ALSO the Molokans FIRST spoke in tongues @ Azusa – was that another pre-Pentecost like version 0.1? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9xMt_69Z_YI
Bishop Bernie L Wade
It seems he means well, but the Azusa Mission could not hold hundreds of people. Lots of smoke and mirrors in this report (literally and figuratively) While nearly all of those who recognize the manifestation of the Holy Spirit in a Pentecostal or Apostolic imprimatur have commonality with the Topeka Outpouring, there are many who have no connection to Los Angeles. Those connected to the Los Angeles Outpouring came from some 8 different churches – not just the Azusa Street Mission. The Apostolic Faith Movement was already global before 1906. Likely, the largest outpouring of the day was in Zion, Illinois. Norris repeatedly mentions the Shekhinah. Does he understand that is a Kaballistic term describe the “feminine nature of God” or “the Divine Feminine”? Lots of things sound cool, but we must be careful. That is the view from my porch.
Troy Day
Bishop Bernie L Wade I am puzzled with the titles alike Jerome Herrick Weymouth what is Chair of 3rd temple and 3rd pentecostl msngrs? Dont we need another resurrection of JESUS for another Pentecost? Link Hudson Peter Vandever Philip Williams Neil Steven Lawrence ĪĪ³Ī³ĪµĪ»ĪæĻ Ī”ĪæĻ ĪÆĪ¶
Neil Steven Lawrence
Troy Day in Missiological books they talk about ‘The Third Wave’, etc.. If it’s big and broad enough we could always welcome another one…š¤
Troy Day
Neil Steven Lawrence 3rd wave is NOT 3rd Pentecost – or is it?
Neil Steven Lawrence
Troy Day whadya tink?
Troy Day
ŠŠ ŠŠ Peter Vandever Neil Steven Lawrence Karen Hamilton Lucas Margaret English de Alminana Marg Mowczko the 3rd wave book by wagner is NOT it – this is NOT about 3rd wave but 3rd Pentecost Link Hudson was gonna buy the book and I was hoping he posts URL to it for all This is the moment when our friend Alfredo needs to stepi in as librarien and find it if you tag him here – especially as it was said the book was co-authored by Arrington…
I am a bit puzzled like John Mushenhouse Jerome Herrick Weymouth Bishop Bernie L Wade on some of the NEW 3rd pentecost terminlogy
– whatexacly is a Chair of the Seer of the 3rd Temple and why does the seminary or ORU need one? Terminology reminds of big Al dowie or more resently of the Jewish rabbi that was habinger or whatever terminology they were using back in 2015
I have only gathered few videos here and there somed articles and pages from the book SO I am asking all Pentecostal historians David Bundy Larry Martin James Philemon Bowers Dale M. Coulter Tony Richie Frank Macchia David Willaim Faupel how is there another Pentecost at Azusa right now without another resurrection of JESUS? is this fullfiling the Azusa prophecy or what? https://www.pentecostaltheology.com/?s=aZUSA+prophecy
John Mushenhouse
People we don’t need a new Pentecost but the empowerment that came with the first one. I think that is what the early Pentecostals believed.
Larry Martin
There was no 100 year Azusa Street prophecy. Pure fiction.
James Philemon Bowers
Two responses. First, much of this is gnostic nonsense. Itās the kind of wild stuff that has been unfortunately associated with Spirit movements forever. Second, itās nonsense because itās unnecessary. We donāt NEED a prophecy of a second Pentecost because Acts makes clear outpourings of the Spirit CAN and MAY happen in response to spiritual needs and seeking believers. Acts 4 records the FIRST such outpouring but certainly not the last in Acts. Perhaps, giving some of these āseersā the benefit of the doubt, they recognize our need for a fresh revival of the Spirit in America especially. Great! Letās pray for that! We donāt need folks telling us what they saw āin the third heavenā as Paul would not do to move us to seek for a fresh Pentecost. If you do, whatās being sought isnāt a Pentecost but a discrediting attempt to grab attention.
Larry Martin
Bishop Bernie L Wade There were as many as 1200 people at the mission on a single night, confirmed by both A G Osterberg and a secular newspaper account. Furthermore the Apostolic Faith was NOT global before 1906, Where do you come up with this stuff?
Anonymous
https://www.pathwaybookstore.com/item/pentecost-again-pb/
Troy Day
John Mushenhouse seems like Michael Chauncey Bishop Bernie L Wade Jerome Herrick Weymouth think about the same. I am copying here what we were told about the worrisome titles
Empowered 21 Asia event being conducted at the Sentul International Convention Center in Bogor, Indonesia when Mrs Cindy Jacobs prophesied and proclaimed Ps. Niko as the āMessenger of the Third Pentecostā. 11,000 persons were gathered
book āPentecost Againā by Niko Njotoraharjo, French Arrington & Tim Hill. At the beginning of the book there is the personal testimony of Pastor Niko and in chapter 4, āGlobal Pentecostalism: The Third Pentecostā. This book from Pathway Press was released in July 2022.
Pastor Niko serves as the Founding Pastor of āGereja Bethel Indonesia affiliated with the Church of God via āAmalgamationā since 1967.
Pentecostal Theological Seminary āChair for the Restoration of the Tabernacle of Davidā
This 24/7 prayer network is now the āAzusa Prayer Towerā (APT)!
In April 14, 2023 they will dedicate the Third Pentecost Azusa Prayer Tower in downtown Los Angeles
Michael Womack RW Deese Mike Partyka Wayne Scott Stan Wayne Doyle Rogers RichardAnna Boyce Pete F. Fiske Jevan Little Daniel J Hesse AND Joseph D. Absher may need to call the guy who lives with his mother – forgetting his name now …
https://www.pathwaybookstore.com/item/pentecost-again-pb/
Troy Day
James Philemon Bowers how could there be another Pentecost without another resurrections of Christ – we’ve found the following
Empowered 21 Asia event being conducted at the Sentul International Convention Center in Bogor, Indonesia when Mrs Cindy Jacobs prophesied and proclaimed Ps. Niko as the āMessenger of the Third Pentecostā. 11,000 persons were gathered
book āPentecost Againā by Niko Njotoraharjo, French Arrington & Tim Hill. At the beginning of the book there is the personal testimony of Pastor Niko and in chapter 4, āGlobal Pentecostalism: The Third Pentecostā. This book from Pathway Press was released in July 2022.
Pastor Niko serves as the Founding Pastor of āGereja Bethel Indonesia affiliated with the Church of God via āAmalgamationā since 1967.
Pentecostal Theological Seminary āChair for the Restoration of the Tabernacle of Davidā
This 24/7 prayer network is now the āAzusa Prayer Towerā (APT)!
In April 14, 2023 they will dedicate the Third Pentecost Azusa Prayer Tower in downtown Los Angeles
https://www.pathwaybookstore.com/item/pentecost-again-pb/
Troy Day
Larry Martin tell us MORE about this brother You would be the one to know what exactly happened There has been several “witnesses” of such one prophecy Of course its fictive timing passed cir 2009 (IMHO) Peter Vandever has claimed before there has been GREAT interest in the prophecy and perhaps SO This is what we could find so far
Empowered 21 Asia event being conducted at the Sentul International Convention Center in Bogor, Indonesia when Mrs Cindy Jacobs prophesied and proclaimed Ps. Niko as the āMessenger of the Third Pentecostā. 11,000 persons were gathered
book āPentecost Againā by Niko Njotoraharjo, French Arrington & Tim Hill. At the beginning of the book there is the personal testimony of Pastor Niko and in chapter 4, āGlobal Pentecostalism: The Third Pentecostā. This book from Pathway Press was released in July 2022.
Pastor Niko serves as the Founding Pastor of āGereja Bethel Indonesia affiliated with the Church of God via āAmalgamationā since 1967.
Pentecostal Theological Seminary āChair for the Restoration of the Tabernacle of Davidā
This 24/7 prayer network is now the āAzusa Prayer Towerā (APT)!
In April 14, 2023 they will dedicate the Third Pentecost Azusa Prayer Tower in downtown Los Angeles
https://www.pathwaybookstore.com/item/pentecost-again-pb/
Troy Day
Larry Martin this is what we are told by @tommy smith (translator) in brief (brief version by myself of what he said in our Pentecostal discussion group)
Empowered 21 Asia event being conducted at the Sentul International Convention Center in Bogor, Indonesia when Mrs Cindy Jacobs prophesied and proclaimed Ps. Niko as the āMessenger of the Third Pentecostā. 11,000 persons were gathered
book āPentecost Againā by Niko Njotoraharjo, French Arrington & Tim Hill. At the beginning of the book there is the personal testimony of Pastor Niko and in chapter 4, āGlobal Pentecostalism: The Third Pentecostā. This book from Pathway Press was released in July 2022.
Pastor Niko serves as the Founding Pastor of āGereja Bethel Indonesia affiliated with the Church of God via āAmalgamationā since 1967.
Pentecostal Theological Seminary āChair for the Restoration of the Tabernacle of Davidā
This 24/7 prayer network is now the āAzusa Prayer Towerā (APT)!
In April 14, 2023 they will dedicate the Third Pentecost Azusa Prayer Tower in downtown Los Angeles
https://www.pathwaybookstore.com/item/pentecost-again-pb/
to answer you direct question – Where do you come up with this stuff?
there is a prayer building now @ Azusa – not tower per se where 24/7 prayer is going on via Zoom – there some titles given like
āChair for the Restoration of the Tabernacle of David messenger of 3rd Pentecost and so on which sparked our interest with Bishop Bernie L Wade who just published his book on PARHAM and Jerome Herrick Weymouth who is actually in LA So we asked around – have you not heard of this 3rd Pentecost and the Azusa prayer tower in particular during your Azusa research ?
Larry Martin
Troy Day There are no contemporary witnesses to this “prophecy.” Zero. It is fictional as are many Azusa stories. If it was a prophesy given by Seymour (and it was not) it would most certainly be a false prophesy. Seymour died more than 100 years ago and the window for such a prophesy to be fulfilled has closed.
Troy Day
Larry Martin I do not disagree with you On the contrary! As you know from our past history I only ask and address you when I need an expert opinion like yours which I personally appreciate greatly PLS advise me – scholar2scholar where do I find solid proof of what you just told me, which I do not disagree with it. I do not wish to make an argument of silence, and would like to present some proof. There is a video on youtube with African lady said to be last witness of Azusa that speaks about the prophecy (some)
Larry Martin
Troy Day Cindy Jacobs has prophesied over me. Most of what she said never came to pass. Some of what she said will never come to pass. The window for it to happen has passed. In my life I have had dozens if not hundreds of prophesies over me. Few have borne any fruit. Most were nonsense. That is all I care to say about personal prophesies. My question about “stuff” was directed to the false statement that the Apostolic Faith was a global movement before 1906. That simply is not true and I challenge anyone to present evidence that it was.
Neil Steven Lawrence
Normally people write books about an event after itās already taken placeā¦ ļæ¼
Troy Day
Neil Steven Lawrence it has been said by bro Tommy that the event has been going on for while and just now moving to 7th str in NY and Azusa Pls tag him here if yall are friends since I cannot…
Troy Day
Michael Chauncey Peter Vandever Link Hudson Neil Steven Lawrence Bishop Bernie L Wade the BOOK is NOT available on Amazon or anywhere else but Pathway THERE it is under the wrong SKU: 9781642882308 Categories: Books, Church of God Authors, Holy Spirit, Inspirational, Personal Growth and marked in their books as out of print. They are checking to see if they can get me a copy but it is not in any accessible libraries NOT even in our catalog @ HDS which is somewhat strange since we get everything from Libr. of Congress by default almost like it has been limited or what?
Troy Day
Larry Martin I am not trying to be funny here JUST the facts – had a friend who was prophicied over at Airport by her – wording from memory, not exact: he was told to become a spiritual stalion; he has been having knee surgeries ever since. Again, not funny at all just the facts. I may need to resort to the prophecy definition by Link Hudson on this one
James Philemon Bowers I am still to this day puzzled as of what is called at Pentecostal Theological Seminary
āChair for the Restoration of the Tabernacle of Davidā
hope this is not about Trump and the 3rd temple thing
Troy Day
http://www.christiannewswire.com/news/5507986882.html
Troy Day
http://www.christiannewswire.com/news/5507986882.html
Troy Day
Seymour’s 100 Year Prophecy Bishop Bernie L Wade
This is all I could find about Seymour’s prophecy. It is NOT well documented @ all. There’s lots of speculation 1909, 1910, 1913, 1922 around his death and so on… Apart from that ppl seem NOT to know that Azusa was over and gone by 1909. Some cite the prophecy from his travelling notes, which you have studied extensively for your book series on Azusa…
It all comes down to Tommy’s book with a single quote from a testimony by one David Garcia who was a boy during Azusa, but recalls being told the words of the prophecy. I will try to attach Tommy’s whole book, but here is the only quote of interest:
“p38 Brother Garcia was the first to tell me of Seymourās prophesy that in about 100 years there would be a return of the Shekinah Glory and a revival that would surpass the Works of God at Azusa.*
It was forty years ago that we spoke, and Brother Garcia told of the 100 year prophesy by Brother Seymour concerning the fresh outpouring of Godās Spirit.
As this book is being written, people all over the world are celebrating the Azusa Centennial. I pray the prayer of my dear friend and brother, David Garcia, that soon we will see Brother Seymourās prophesy fulfilled and the greatest visitation of God ever known to man fall fresh on this world.
*Charles Parham also prophesied that another great revival would happen in about 100 years.
Seymour, who made the prophesy around 1909 or 1910 may have made this prophesy after Parham.”
James Philemon Bowers
Troy Day, that designation of āChair for the Restoration of the Tabernacle of Davidā I suspect means nothing. The way it works is people give money to endow (pay the teacher) a chair with all kinds of names and desired emphases. I suspect thatās what that is. Niko paid to have a chair with that name. French Arrington is not going to teach anything like that although he might give a nod to the idea ā whatever it is. There are chairs called āBenevolence,ā āLay Involvement,ā āSpiritual Renewal,ā etc. There are lots of creative ways schools take the money, scratch the itch or humor the donor, and basically ignore their nuttiness. In fact, if you check the courses listed in their academic catalog, you will NOT FIND ONE COURSE connected to āRestoration of the Tabernacle of David.ā Itās phoney baloney. They likely took the money for the chair and maybe have Niko or whoever come talk about something nutty. I doubt even that happening.
Troy Day
James Philemon Bowers THANKS this puzzled me personally quite a bit. I’ve sat with him @ some Biblical Greek forums and the man is a fantastic scholar. HOWEVER when Link Hudson made a valuable connection with Niko’s translator we were told :
“in the chapter on Global Pentecostalismāthe Third Pentecostā¦this book jointly written by Tim Hill, French Arrington & Niko Njotoraharjo was launched at the Pentecost Again Celebration at Azusa Street last July ”
I am yet to see the said chapter as the book is NOT on Amazon; however, this whole chair/title thing maybe a bad play off his 2020 book – Restoration of the Tabernacle of David: The Mission of the Church also not on Amazon just Pathway Press (also puzzling to me) https://www.pathwaybookstore.com/item/pentecost-again-pb/
Bishop Bernie L Wade
Larry Martin I have waited to respond because I wanted to take time to absorb your comment. I have to admit I was stunned. I give you great credit for saying what most would not dare say on the plethora of false prophecies by self proclaimed prophets (profits).
Troy Day
Bishop Bernie L Wade yes you found it here
Bishop Bernie L Wade
Larry Martin Thank you for your response. Let me give you a modern comparison. I know many people (perhaps you do as well), that say my friend Thomas Jakes has 25,000 in his church service. It is also in newspapers and on their website. Yet, the building seats about 7,000. People are rarely experts on crowd size. Now, 1200 nightly at the Apostolic Faith Gospel Mission? If they stacked them in like lumber maybe. We have good pics of the interior and it would not hold that many people. 1200 nightly at the 8 or more locations of the Los Angeles Outpouring. Certainly. Where do I get this stuff? It is called Historical investigation. Lot of good historians (like yourself). I deeply appreciate your contribution. But just because someone thought it, or the newspaper said it does not make it a fact.
Troy Day
what else do we know about this Bishop Bernie L Wade perhaps Link Hudson can tell us from his Bartleman book as well…
Bishop Bernie L Wade
As to the Global Impetus of the Topeka Outpouring. The Topeka outpouring was at least 3 years before the Wales Revival. It was the subject of news articles, college professors, and other media. The Topeka Outpouring changed the conversation. Those teaching Cessation found the Topeka Outpouring a direct contradiction. Thus, they either sought to know more or to discredit those who led the movement. By 1903, the Topeka Outpouring was well known and was source material for the Wales Revival as well as many lesser known outpourings such as Louisville, Kentucky, Schenectady, New York, etc. It was, in fact, this impetus that brought Los Angeles ministries and churches to seek their own outpouring before Apostolic Faith adherents arrived in 1905 to have tent meetings. While Pentecostal groups have arrogantly claimed the Los Angeles Outpouring as their own, evidence is lacking that anyone in Los Angeles in 1906 identified themself as a “Pentecostal”. Rather they sought an experience that they identified as their personal “Pentecost”. This was a term that had been in use by Methodist adherents for nearly a century. By 1905, much of the United States, including Los Angeles, was praying for an outpouring of the Holy Spirit. Thank God!
Let me also give you some historical evidence on the Apostolic Faith Mission on Azusa Street. This building was formerly F.A.M.E. The historic First African Methodist Episcopal church. The F.A.M.E. group moved from the location because it was too small and the lot was not suitable to build larger. If this building could seat 1200 as is proposed, then the F.A.M.E. congregation would simply have stayed. Also, research the number of churches at the time that could seat 1000 or more. They were few.
Anonymous
THANK YOU Dr. Larry Martin for stating with scholarly certainty
“There was no 100 year Azusa Street prophecy. Pure fiction. There are no contemporary witnesses to this “prophecy.” Zero. It is fictional as are many Azusa stories. If it was a prophesy given by Seymour (and it was not) it would most certainly be a false prophesy. Seymour died more than 100 years ago and the window for such a prophesy to be fulfilled has closed.
Anonymous
I do not disagree with you On the contrary! As you know from our past history I only ask and address you when I need an expert opinion like yours which I personally appreciate greatly PLS advise me – scholar2scholar where do I find solid proof of what you just told me, which I do not disagree with it. I do not wish to make an argument of silence, and would like to present some proof. There is a video on youtube with African lady said to be last witness of Azusa that speaks about the prophecy (some)
This is all I could find about Seymour’s prophecy. It is NOT well documented @ all. There’s lots of speculation 1909, 1910, 1913, 1922 around his death and so on… Apart from that ppl seem NOT to know that Azusa was over and gone by 1909. Some cite the prophecy from his travelling notes, which you have studied extensively for your book series on Azusa…
It all comes down to Tommy’s book with a single quote from a testimony by one David Garcia who was a boy during Azusa, but recalls being told the words of the prophecy. I will try to attach Tommy’s whole book, but here is the only quote of interest:
“p38 Brother Garcia was the first to tell me of Seymourās prophesy that in about 100 years there would be a return of the Shekinah Glory and a revival that would surpass the Works of God at Azusa.*
It was forty years ago that we spoke, and Brother Garcia told of the 100 year prophesy by Brother Seymour concerning the fresh outpouring of Godās Spirit.
As this book is being written, people all over the world are celebrating the Azusa Centennial. I pray the prayer of my dear friend and brother, David Garcia, that soon we will see Brother Seymourās prophesy fulfilled and the greatest visitation of God ever known to man fall fresh on this world.
*Charles Parham also prophesied that another great revival would happen in about 100 years.
Seymour, who made the prophesy around 1909 or 1910 may have made this prophesy after Parham.”
Anonymous
THANK YOU Bishop Bernie L Wade for confirming with the following:
“Larry Martin I have waited to respond because I wanted to take time to absorb your comment. I have to admit I was stunned. I give you great credit for saying what most would not dare say on the plethora of false prophecies by self proclaimed prophets (profits). Thank you for your response. Let me give you a modern comparison. I know many people (perhaps you do as well), that say my friend Thomas Jakes has 25,000 in his church service. It is also in newspapers and on their website. Yet, the building seats about 7,000. People are rarely experts on crowd size. Now, 1200 nightly at the Apostolic Faith Gospel Mission? If they stacked them in like lumber maybe. We have good pics of the interior and it would not hold that many people. 1200 nightly at the 8 or more locations of the Los Angeles Outpouring. Certainly. Where do I get this stuff? It is called Historical investigation. Lot of good historians (like yourself). I deeply appreciate your contribution. But just because someone thought it, or the newspaper said it does not make it a fact.
As to the Global Impetus of the Topeka Outpouring. The Topeka outpouring was at least 3 years before the Wales Revival. It was the subject of news articles, college professors, and other media. The Topeka Outpouring changed the conversation. Those teaching Cessation found the Topeka Outpouring a direct contradiction. Thus, they either sought to know more or to discredit those who led the movement. By 1903, the Topeka Outpouring was well known and was source material for the Wales Revival as well as many lesser known outpourings such as Louisville, Kentucky, Schenectady, New York, etc. It was, in fact, this impetus that brought Los Angeles ministries and churches to seek their own outpouring before Apostolic Faith adherents arrived in 1905 to have tent meetings. While Pentecostal groups have arrogantly claimed the Los Angeles Outpouring as their own, evidence is lacking that anyone in Los Angeles in 1906 identified themself as a āPentecostalā. Rather they sought an experience that they identified as their personal āPentecostā. This was a term that had been in use by Methodist adherents for nearly a century. By 1905, much of the United States, including Los Angeles, was praying for an outpouring of the Holy Spirit. Thank God!
Let me also give you some historical evidence on the Apostolic Faith Mission on Azusa Street. This building was formerly F.A.M.E. The historic First African Methodist Episcopal church. The F.A.M.E. group moved from the location because it was too small and the lot was not suitable to build larger. If this building could seat 1200 as is proposed, then the F.A.M.E. congregation would simply have stayed. Also, research the number of churches at the time that could seat 1000 or more. They were few.”
Anonymous
Troy Day Once again Bishop Bernie L Wade has proven he does not know what he is talking about. It is amusing that he is trying to school me on the history of the mission. I wrote the book on the mission. I guess this is how you respond when you have a basket full of degrees that aren’t worth the paper they are printed on. It is so sad that genuine scholarship is so often discounted in this group.
Anonymous
Bishop Bernie L Wade just my 2c – I have spoken during the pandemic with Dr. Mel and have bugged him about this some (quite a bit actually). There were about 40 seats @ the original Azusa; the benches were set as in a 3/4 stage though there was no stage OR podium at first; however many came through payer in-n-out constantly; this went on 3 times a day for 3 yrs as we all well know. There was even more going on via various groups and leaders (including Bartleman @ 8th and Maple str.) and many parks where his immigrant wife had a prominent role (one of few white women at the time supporting Azusa); especially among Molokans who first spoke in tongues in even before the Azusa revival started:
“Molokans followed the prophecy and reached first Canada via Japan and Seattle and later on California. After passing through the quarantine station in Ayala Cove, many settled in Los Angeles, the Central Valley and San Francisco. Because of their prior experience with Holy Spirit outpourings in the homeland, Molokans were naturally drawn to the Azusa Street Revival (1906-1909). The surrounding streets in E. Los Angeles and Oakeās Lot (Pecan Playground) were home of Slavic immigrants many of which belonged to the Molokan faith. Frank Bartleman reported his meetings at the close by Boyle Heights and what later became known as the āRussian Flatsā,
āJanuary 2, I testified and helped in an all-day meeting at Boyle Heights M. E. Church, walking there, not having car-fare. Being very tired I asked the Lord for my carfare home, and found a nickel on the side-walk. I rode home.ā
His Bulgarian born wife, Anna, was well acquainted with ministering among Russian immigrants as early as their assignment in McKees Rocks. She would have been able to freely communicate and minister to the Slavs present at the early Pentecostal meetings in Los Angeles as well. When the revival moved to Azusa, the Apostolic Faith newspaper too affirmed the presence of Russian Molokans who spoke in tongues and heard others baptized in the Spirit speaking their mother tongue. As soon as the first edition announced that āPentecost Has come,ā it also reported that:
āRUSSIANS HEAR IN THEIR OWN TONGUE.
Different nationalities are now hearing the Gospel in their own ātongue wherein they were born.ā Sister Anna Hall spoke to the Russians in their church in Los Angeles, in their own language as the Spirit gave utterance. They were so glad to hear the truth that they wept and even kissed her hands. They are a very simple, pure, and hungry people for the full Gospel. The other night, as a company of Russians were present in the meeting, Bro. Lee, a converted Catholic, was permitted to speak their language. As he spoke and sang, one of the Russians came up and embraced him. It was a holy sight, and the Spirit fell upon the Russians, as well as on others, and they glorified God.ā
The Apostolic Faith reported also of Russian and Armenian Pryguny in attendance who lived in the Boyle Heights āRussian Flatsā and held meetings at Bethlehem Institutional Church and Stimson-Lafayette Industrial School:
āRussians and Armenians in Los Angeles are seeking the baptism. The Armenians have a Pentecostal cottage meeting on Victor street, between 4th and 5th. Some have been baptized with the Holy Ghost.ā
This cited from https://www.amazon.com/Unforgotten-Historical-Theological-Pentecostalism-Bulgaria/dp/B094L7FD9K AND from Brill’s Encyclopedia of Global Pentecostalism Online (BEGP), which also provides a comprehensive overview of early Pentecostalism at Azusa
Anonymous
Troy Day Wow. This is quite excellent. Thank you.
Anonymous
Have you read this book?
Anonymous
Bishop Bernie L Wade I was an advisor (among many others)
Anonymous
Neil Steven Lawrence to Bishop Bernie L Wade
Truth be told, I think the over emphasis on the beginnings of Pentecost being in Los Angeles or Azuza street or whatever have a tendency to cause an ethnocentric view whenever the greater reality of God moving all over the world around the same time is downplayed. I think the global move is more interesting of a story than the quirky beginnings at Azuza streetā¦IMHOļæ¼.
In my own ethnocentric view: COG began in 1886 and the Holy Spirit was poured out for the first time in 1896. Though it was in the mountains with Appalachian people and not in the city with LA people it still happen firstā¦
But even there the global story of the Holy Spirit being in charge of his last days outpouring is more interesting.ļæ¼ļæ¼
Bishop Bernie L Wade My Baptist Great Grandfather received the Holy Ghost speaking in other tongues in Tennessee during that early 1900s revival
WHICH ONE? the were was one revival in 1896 in NC
another in in 1907 near Cleveland
and following COG received the Holy Spirit cir. 1913
and it split 10 years later – exactly one century ago John Mushenhouse
Anonymous
Troy Day yes I read the transcripts of the court trail when the archives were not arranged in the old Library at Lee.
Anonymous
YES John Mushenhouse Report Of Investigation Proceeding of Elders Council and Correspondence. Convened at Cleveland, Tennessee June 12-21, 1923. A.J. Tomlinson We discussed it back in 2016 – what is there today 100 yrs that needs to be addressed once again? https://www.pentecostaltheology.com/the-1923-church-of-god-report-of-investigation-on-a-j-tomlinson/
Anonymous
money and power
Anonymous
Troy I saw the court documents – the transcripts of Tomlison trail and not F.J. Lee’s kangaroo court.
Anonymous
John Mushenhouse Power and the money, money and the power ~Coolio
Anonymous
That would be Coker Creek. 19 miles from our families home in Strawberry Plains, Tennessee.
Anonymous
Bishop Bernie L Wade Fire-Baptized REVIVAL of Coker Creek (Camp Creek) was in 1896 at the Shearer Schoolhouse which burnt down and only A FEW spoke in tongues there according to Dr Wade Phillips John Mushenhouse Neil Steven Lawrence Jeffrey Snyder Tony Richie
Anonymous
Troy Day that is the tradition
Anonymous
Michael Edwards can you confirm?
Anonymous
Jeffrey Snyder who is he what are his qualification why is he needed to confirm known historical facts? And how can he is not even a member of this here group?
Anonymous
John Mushenhouse Bishop Bernie L Wade I read and re-read your comments a few times this morning; I am not seeing anything out of line – we need to talk our Pentecostal history UNTIL we figure it out in my opinion So lets keep on talking the TRUTH – if someone gets mad ohWell
Anonymous
Troy Day M.A. Tomlinson was his grandpa, making A.J. his great-grandpa. š
Anonymous
Jeffrey Snyder I wouldnt brag M.A. being my grandpas Same goes for the great grand-daughter of FJ Briyan if you knew her
Anonymous
Troy Day no brag, just thinking they may have had a closer in family relationship than those who are on the outside being speculative? But maybe not. According to my dadās generation: In that era, most everyone kept everything a secret. This includes groceries purchased, food eaten, General bed time. So, who knows???š¤šµāš«
Anonymous
Jeffrey Snyder how do you mean?
Anonymous
Troy Day, I mean… those generations seemed to be taught if you’re not family, and at times even family, you don’t need to know anything. Now, M.A. and A.J. Tomlinson were faithful to God’s calling in their lives. As for their Children, well …. that’s who the devil goes after.
Anonymous
Bishop Bernie L Wade what is the final conclusion we can draw here
there was NO Azusa prophecy as Peter Vandever claimed before
If ther was ANY word it was originally Parham’s?
there is very little proof Parham ever had any such word given…
Anonymous
NOW Link Hudson I do have a dog in this fight Bishop Bernie L Wade cause I advised on book about Bartleman’s wife and still not sure which book Link referred to – I also did a brief search upon the recommended sources Larry gave me AS stated in my comments above AND on several others posts here in the past week
//repeated stuff follows:
Seymourās prophecy is NOT well documented @ all. Thereās lots of speculation 1909, 1910, 1913, 1922 around his death and so onā¦ Apart from that ppl seem NOT to know that Azusa was over and gone by 1909. Some cite the prophecy from his travelling notes, which you have studied extensively for your book series on Azusaā¦
It all comes down to Tommyās book with a single quote from a testimony by one David Garcia who was a boy during Azusa, but recalls being told the words of the prophecy. I will try to attach Tommyās whole book, but here is the only quote of interest:
āp38 Brother Garcia was the first to tell me of Seymourās prophesy that in about 100 years there would be a return of the Shekinah Glory and a revival that would surpass the Works of God at Azusa.*
It was forty years ago that we spoke, and Brother Garcia told of the 100 year prophesy by Brother Seymour concerning the fresh outpouring of Godās Spirit.
As this book is being written, people all over the world are celebrating the Azusa Centennial. I pray the prayer of my dear friend and brother, David Garcia, that soon we will see Brother Seymourās prophesy fulfilled and the greatest visitation of God ever known to man fall fresh on this world.
*Charles Parham also prophesied that another great revival would happen in about 100 years.
Seymour, who made the prophesy around 1909 or 1910 may have made this prophesy after Parham.ā
//more repeated stuff here
IF THERE IS NO 100 yr Pentecost HOW could there be a messenger one such not existing prophecy ??? Bishop Bernie L Wade James Philemon Bowers
Pastor Niko serves as the Founding Pastor of āGereja Bethel Indonesia affiliated with the Church of God via āAmalgamationā since 1967.
His Pentecostal Theological Seminary title is
āChair for the Restoration of the Tabernacle of Davidā ?!?
his book says nothing to that extent
https://www.pathwaybookstore.com/item/pentecost-again-pb/
Jerome Herrick Weymouth has checked that there is no prayer TOWER per se now @ Azusa ā 24/7 prayer is going on via Zoom in another language ā there some titles given like
āChair for the Restoration of the Tabernacle of David messenger of 3rd Pentecost and so on which sparked our interest with Bishop Bernie L Wade who just published his book on PARHAM and Jerome Herrick Weymouth who is actually in LA So we asked around ā have you not heard of this 3rd Pentecost and the Azusa prayer tower in particular during your Azusa research or Indonesian connection ?
Anonymous
Jeffrey Snyder A.J. YES granted – Homer who wanted to be president and king of the world NOT so much but what is this adding to our discourse here? We already talked with John Mushenhouse that it is fixing to be 100yrs since the great scism – are you saying another one is coming to cog/cogop cogJacres and THEcog?
Nov. 26, 1908 Cleveland. During my sermon I broke down and went to crying, and the Holy Ghost caught up Homer, my own son, and he went to preaching in tongues until he and I and others fell under deep groans and weeping and praying. This continued for some length of time, which was really demonstrating the last part of my text, but after while I was able to finish my sermon and close the meeting.
https://www.pentecostaltheology.com/preaching-in-tongues-among-early-pentecostals-nov-26-1908-cleveland/
Anonymous
Byron Meko Lorenz Frank earlier asked
Ā·
Looking into the 100 year prophecy by William J. Seymour
Can someone tell me where it was recorded (book or article) and the particulars, time, date, location and who was the one who reported it.
All I have found is YouTube videos mentioning it as well internet articles with no reference to where they got their information
Thanks a lot !
Peter Vandever said it was never given 100 yrs ago SO it will never come to pass
Duane L Burgess does not beleive ANY prophecy
Philip Williams believes only prophecy from his pope
Danny Payton claims Seymour is not the founder. but Evelyn Gardiner pointed to Dr. Vinson Synan who literally said All Pentecostal trace roots to Azusa? https://www.pentecostalnews.com/2023/07/01/true-or-false-all-pentecostal-trace-roots-to-azusa-by-dr-vinson-synan/
Anonymous
Judith Smith you obviously did not even READ Dr Synan’s article
Anonymous
Troy Day did I say I read the article? I said, “in answer to this question in the article you posted, “TRUE or FALSE: All Pentecostal trace roots to Azusa? by Dr. Vinson Synan.” My answer is false because the roots of pentecostalism can be traced back to Acts 2 in the Bible.”
“A Pentecostal Revival took place on Azusa Street. That was not the beginning of Pentecostalism in America.”
“Revival means “bring back” to life. Didn’t the slaves who adopted Christianity practice Pentecostalism? Where did they get it from?”
Why do I have to read the article to answer the question?
Anonymous
Judith Smith you are in the WRONG thread dear – please get it right
Anonymous
whatS @everyone else think about all this INTEREST IN THE 100 YEARS PAST AZUSA STREET NEW REVIVAL PROPHECY lately ? – some more about it here https://www.pentecostaltheology.com/there-has-been-a-lot-of-interest-in-the-100-years-past-azusa-street-new-revival-prophecy/
Anonymous
Thank you for your insight and encouragemnet to share your calling to those that have no oidea what Pentecostal Theology is all about!
Anonymous
Glenn Lovell as clearly explained in the discerption this group discusses PRACTICAL APPLICATION OF PENTECOSTAL THEOLOGY IN POLITICS, ECONOMY AND SOCIAL ISSUES https://www.pentecostaltheology.com/
Anonymous
Iām not sure why so many are focussed on āyesteryear.ā I believe We need more modern day leaders and clarion voices, not more church historians.
Anonymous
Guy Duininck actually it focuses on a prophecy for the future of the movement
Anonymous
Troy Day – I understand that.
Anonymous
Troy Day – the only movement Iām interested in is the church moving in the plans of God.
Anonymous
Guy Duininck do you mean Pentecostalism is NOT moving in the plans of God?
Anonymous
In these latter days the challenge is not to be deceived, I see in my own life the need not to be distracted.
God planned on us being here we need to appreciate this challenge and to press forward to the high calling of Christ for our sake, our family, and our church āŖļø š.
Anonymous
Ed Welch amen to the remnant. May they continue to stand, and to not bow.ļæ¼ Waiting for the sound of the seventh Trump. Rak Chazak Amats
Anonymous
Ed Welch are you sure about this – where it says it in the BIBLE
Anonymous
Ed Welch IRWIN TAUGHT BAPTISMS OF FIRE, DYNAMITE, LYDDITE AND OXIDITE https://www.pentecostaltheology.com/irwin-taught-baptisms-of-fire-dynamite-lyddite-and-oxidite/
Anonymous
Troy Day lookup in Scripture deceived and latter days. God being God can plan timing of people being on earth John the Baptist and Jesus, antichrist, and leaders of nations.
Anonymous
Ed Welch why dont you lookup in Scripture and post here when done?
Anonymous
Byron Meko Lorenz Frank has NOT yet followed up on the questions posted but maybe this short discussion will give some more answers today
Anonymous
Troy Day what questions? I am looking for sources for my original question
Anonymous
It’s time when the door opened, the time of changes, the time of Jesus.
Anonymous
Petro Mwazyele your question on the 100 years past Azusa street new revival prophecy
Anonymous
Dan Riley just commented THIS
Thank you Brother for setting the record straight. The Church of God (Cleveland) was organized in 1906! My grandmother received Spirit Baptism in 1904, after coming in contact with a young woman with ties to the people of the Apostolic Faith (Parhamās group). She United with the Church of God (Cleveland) in 1910.
Anonymous
Troy Day the Cleveland Tennessee Church of God was organized in 1886.
Anonymous
Dan Riley just commented THIS
Thank you Brother for setting the record straight. The Church of God (Cleveland) was organized in 1906! My grandmother received Spirit Baptism in 1904, after coming in contact with a young woman with ties to the people of the Apostolic Faith (Parhamās group). She United with the Church of God (Cleveland) in 1910.
Anonymous
Troy Day could it be that Pentecostalism (the belief in the post- conversion experience of baptism in the Holy Spirit) was practiced throughout history but its doctrine was articulated by Charles Parham and catalysed by Joseph Seymour in the Azusa Revival???
Anonymous
Esther Yateesa weVE discussed with Link Hudson long ago that THE MOLOKANS SPOKE IN TONGUES Dr. Dayton in his post considered Pentecostalism in AMERICA alone? https://www.pentecostaltheology.com/the-molokans-claim-to-have-spoken-in-tongues-2/
Anonymous
Esther Yateesa Irving wrote something that MIGHT indicate he believed in Pentecostalism’s initial evidence doctrine.
I know of no other evidence if anyone in history teaching it before then. (Paul asked “Not all speak in tongues do they?”)
There are books and websites that mentioned occassional references to speaking in tongues throughout human history. In the 1800s there were also instances reported in meetings in Germany, among Methodists in Georgia, even a reference to a New Light Baptist speaking in tongurs.
Historical references to visions, prophecies, and healing seem more numerous.
Anonymous
Link Hudson IRWIN TAUGHT BAPTISMS OF FIRE, DYNAMITE, LYDDITE AND OXIDITE https://www.pentecostaltheology.com/irwin-taught-baptisms-of-fire-dynamite-lyddite-and-oxidite/
Anonymous
Troy Day first was teaching on baptism of fire, if I recall reading correctly, before going off into these other things. I read there was speaking in tongues among Fore Baptized Holiness. It became part of Pentecostalism. The conservative group of them still existed around Commerce GA when I was in college.
Anonymous
Link Hudson you can say that but you dont have the foggiest what IRWIN TAUGHT in BAPTISMS OF FIRE, DYNAMITE, LYDDITE AND OXIDITE https://www.pentecostaltheology.com/irwin-taught-baptisms-of-fire-dynamite-lyddite-and-oxidite
Anonymous
Troy Day i read that ithe late brother Synan’s book when I was a teenager.
Anonymous
Link Hudson Commerce GA has the Tanger Outlets and it is the lowest ever where I gassed up @53c/gal during Clinton when I was teaching there Your knowledge of Pentecostalism extends no further than to about there – I have also discovered that big-talk Peter Pentecost-Pan has only observatory knowing of some revival services. Was not there the whole time – did not get dipped fully immersed into Pentecostal theology and is still following small time charismatics who are mainly baptist but not really Pentecostal
Anonymous
Troy Day I was raised Pentecostal, but I seek to be faithful to scripture in doctrine, not just follow whatever any Pentecostal preacher says. I am reasonably well-read about the history of the Pentecostal movement. I’ve spent some time among different varieties of Charismatics over the years.
Anonymous
I’;d be considering this one too Michael Ellis Carter Jr. Isara Mo Rasiah Thomas Ricky Grimsley
Anonymous
what cannot be true here? Ron Culbreth Karsten Wille Mauricio Smith Ivan Karel Michael Ellis Carter Jr. Philip Williams Dale M. Coulter Link Hudson
https://www.pentecostalnews.com/2023/07/01/true-or-false-all-pentecostal-trace-roots-to-azusa-by-dr-vinson-synan/
Dr. Vinson Synan said it so it is like that
All Pentecostal trace roots to Azusa?
Does any of yall know MORE than Dr. Vinson Synan about this?
do share your higher revelation with @everyone
Anonymous
Troy Day No disrespect to Dr. Synan (or to William Seymour for that matter), but spiritual gifts continued throughout church history. Historians record many occurrences in some of the great revivals. In the Church of God (Cleveland, TN), people were being filled with the Holy Spirit with the evidence of speaking in tongues before the turn of the 20th century.
William Seymourās influence and place in history are well deserved, though. We all owe a great deal to his legacy for seeing the Full-Gospel preached and for his leadership helping to heal racial divides.
Anonymous
Troy Day definitely not true. There were so many different movements. It just happens to be that one particular movement received so much more attention than others.
Anonymous
Troy Day Theologically yes. The distinct Pentecostal doctrines can be traced to Azusa. Otherwise no. There were simultaneous Pentecostal revivals in Korea, Wales, and in my country (Czech republic).
So it’s really quite difficult to answer. It depends on how you define Pentecostal movement.
Anonymous
Troy Day brother Summerall has a book Pioneers of the Faith that discuss many several leaders who help lead Pentecostal movements that were not connected to Azusa. Yet many of them either contributed to or some how were influenced by the movement. I think we may be surprised at how many movements actually can be traced back to Azusa.
Anonymous
Troy Day with all humility I state its false. We can share with you independent Pentecostal experiences from Africa, specifically from Ghana and Nigeria etc. However, these institutionsgradually accepted the theological categorizations provided by Western education. For instance it was natural for them to see Christians praying in tongues as a means of spiritual empowerment because it is evident in the local African traditional religion. However, they called themselves prayer warriors etc..not pentecostals, initially etc .I made this comment at the SPS conference in 2002 and advised research be carried out because God is working all over tge world, using different people etc
Anonymous
Elving Ellis Spot on. In fact, very few people can trace their roots to Azusa Street. More may trace their roots to the Los Angeles Outpouring. However, nearly all of us have been impacted by the Topeka Outpouring.
Anonymous
Todd Shaw there is absolutely NO such examples
the Church of God (Cleveland, TN) did NOT exist before 20th century.
In the Church of God (Cleveland, TN), people were being filled with the Holy Spirit with the evidence of speaking in tongues before the turn of the 20th century.
PROOVE ME wrong Neil Steven Lawrence Tony Edwards Tony Richie but first read BUT first read Wade H. Phillips book series https://www.amazon.com/Quest-Restore-Gods-House-Formation-Transformation-Reformation/dp/193593144X
Anonymous
The Church of God began as the Christian Union. They changed their name at the request of their leader as he believed that they had aligned themselves with the Church of God of the Bible. Consider this following excerpt from Wikipedia:
āThe Church of God was a part of the holiness movement and believed in entire sanctification as a definite experience occurring after salvation. While individuals had spoken in tongues in the 1896 revival, tongues were not yet understood by the Church of God to be the initial evidence of baptism in the Holy Spirit. As news of the Azusa Street Revival began to spread and reach the Southeast, Church of God adherents began, more and more, to seek and obtain Spirit baptism.ā
Anonymous
Byron Meko Lorenz Frank here is your original question
asked Jul 2, 2023, 5:10 PM
try NOT to forget it again
Looking into the 100 year prophecy by William J. Seymour
Can someone tell me where it was recorded (book or article) and the particulars, time, date, location and who was the one who reported it.
All I have found is YouTube videos mentioning it as well internet articles with no reference to where they got their information
Thanks a lot !
Anonymous
Troy Day I didnāt forget it
Have received no references to sources as of yetā¦
Anonymous
God stopped giving prophecies in the first century.
Read Hebrews 1 carefully.
Anonymous
Duane L Burgess God is alive and well and gives his people what they need….why are you a cessionist a member of this chat when you don’t believe in the Pentecostal way.
Anonymous
Duane L Burgess Iāll prophecy is subservient to the canon scripture. It never needs to stop if itās subservient to the canon of scripture as it should be.
Anonymous
Duane L Burgess read the whole Bible!!!
If prophecy ceased so did every other gift.
Use logic brother
Anonymous
Duane L Burgess I’d say Byron Meko Lorenz Frank Philip Williams have it from a good source you are dead wrong SOURCE: The Book of Revelation
Anonymous
Byron Meko Lorenz Frank you are asking way too much! Thatās so far above his head.
Anonymous
Philip Williams how is this a thing your granny would approve?
Anonymous
Many Pentecostal churches in Kenya came out of the East Africa Revival Movement which began in the Anglican church in Rwanda in early 1970s. They have no connection to Azusa at all!
Anonymous
East Africa Revival movement had nothing to do with pentecostal churches in Kenya
Anonymous
Bishop Gerishon Njoroge Get your facts right. Out of the East Africa Revival Movement came the Deliverance church, and a myriad of other indigenous Pentecostal churches. However, in latter years East Africa Revival Movement was confined mainly in the Anglican and Presbyterian churches
Anonymous
Wangure’s Reflections unfortunately the Anglican church in Uganda whose faith was catalysed by the East African Revival, and specifically by Dr Joe Church who had been sent by the KESWICK mission to Rwanda/ Uganda rejected the Theology and practice of the “second blessing”, baptism in the Holy Spirit for power to witness. They believed in the finished work of Jesus plus nothing more.
So, much as the East African Revival laid a foundation for Pentecostalism which later came in 1961 in Uganda, it did not start it.
The people who planted the first Pentecostal Churches in many of the East African countries had their roots in the Azusa Revival ie Elim church, Assemblies of God, Full Gospel Churches of Ug/ Glad Tidings Mission in Canada, and Pentecostal Churches of Ug/ Pentecostal Assemblies of Canada. We are truly grateful to God for those missionaries.
Anonymous
Esther Yateesa True
Anonymous
Wangure’s Reflections East Africa Revival movement had nothing to do with pentecostal churches in Kenya
Anonymous
Troy Day The Deliverance church and the offshoots Gospel Outreach, Gospel Revival church and a lot of the indigenous Pentecostal churches were birthed from the East Africa revival movement.
The churches with roots in Americas are the older Pentecostal Assemblies PAG Canada, Kenya Assemblies of God (America), the Full Gospel (Finnish & Swedish missionaries), the Pentecostal Evangelistic Fellowship of Africa.
The older Pentecostals had little influence on the church landscape in Kenya but after the EARM in the 70s, the offshoots Deliverance church, Gospel Outreach, Gospel Revival…these literally took Pentecostalism to every part of Kenya in the 80s and the 90s. The revival also re-energized the old Pentecostals so they too grew and spread alongside the newer Pentecostal churches that had sprung up from the revival movement.
However, some of the names that are most mentioned in the East Africa Revival Movement were born again and interacted with the likes of T.L.Osborn and others who had preached in Kenya even before the revival.
Anyone interested in the history of the Pentecostal church in Kenya can find out these facts because some of the men and women of God who were in the heart of the revival are still alive, and most respectable Pentecostal ministers are just second generation…
I’ve had the privilege to sit with some of them. Though there is no neat story line on the events and people, if you follow Joe Kayo, George Gichana, Margaret WangarĆ®,
Anonymous
As long as the HolySpirit lives in Gods people there will be prophecy and a prophetic movement. Because we donāt war against flesh and blood.
Anonymous
Bill Terrell IRWIN TAUGHT BAPTISMS OF FIRE, DYNAMITE, LYDDITE AND OXIDITE https://www.pentecostaltheology.com/irwin-taught-baptisms-of-fire-dynamite-lyddite-and-oxidite/
Anonymous
Being Pentecostal is traced to the Bible in Acts. Itās biblical/ not just a church idea.
Anonymous
Emmett Mary Smith IRWIN TAUGHT BAPTISMS OF FIRE, DYNAMITE, LYDDITE AND OXIDITE https://www.pentecostaltheology.com/irwin-taught-baptisms-of-fire-dynamite-lyddite-and-oxidite/
Anonymous
Wherever the fullness of the spirit is preached/ signs will follow.
Anonymous
š
Anonymous
I thought this forum was supposed to be “Pentecostal Theology” but it seems more like “Anti-Pentecostal Theology.” I am very disappointed.
Anonymous
Donald Phillips IRWIN TAUGHT BAPTISMS OF FIRE, DYNAMITE, LYDDITE AND OXIDITE https://www.pentecostaltheology.com/irwin-taught-baptisms-of-fire-dynamite-lyddite-and-oxidite/
Anonymous
Donald Phillips it is one’s view of Pentecostal theology and you may disagree with it. If you do then you need to correct the errors according to the word of God. We don’t complain on others, but we teach the truth with patience.
Anonymous
John Mushenhouse do you think Pentecost only began at Azuza?
Anonymous
Donald Phillips no —– I think we have had outbreaks before in numerous places. I think Azusa brought it to the public’s attention thanks to the press and from there it spread. You must know I was taught by Charles Parham’s daughter in law , but I believe that there were outbreaks before Topeka.
Anonymous
Donald Phillips NO!
Anonymous
Link Hudson you also met brother Synan or Daton while itinerating @ORU but Wangure’s Reflections stated more Pentecostal truth in one post than you did in the past year or two along with Peter Vandever and Philip Williams who almost sold a property to the late grate Peter Wagner – yalls Pentecosalism stops till about there
Anonymous
Troy Day If you have something specific and solid you want to discuss or ask me, go ahead. Otherwise, please do not tag me.
Anonymous
Link Hudson I was discussing your specific and solid meeting with brother Synan or Daton while itinerating @ORU – what else is there?
Anonymous
I encourage you to read the new Parham book. We answer most of these questions in detail. Would love feedback after reading.
Media: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10161066252129396&set=p.10161066252129396&type=3
Anonymous
I read it several times – I am not at peace with the story on Parham
particularly this issue we are discussing here
Perhaps I missed it by a mile
which page to read for a proper explanation ?
Anonymous
The root of Pentecostalism is in Acts 2 of the Bible.
Anonymous
Judith Smith prove that The root of American Pentecostalism is in Acts 2 of the Bible – just try to prove it beyond the historical clichĆ©s Aint SO easy
Anonymous
Troy Day in answer to this question in the article you posted, “TRUE or FALSE: All Pentecostal trace roots to Azusa? by Dr. Vinson Synan.” My answer is false because the roots of pentecostalism can be traced back to Acts 2 in the Bible.
A Pentecostal Revival took place on Azusa Street. That was not the beginning of Pentecostalism in America.
Revival means “bring back” to life. Didn’t the slaves who adopted Christianity practice Pentecostalism? Where did they get it from?
Anonymous
Judith Smith you are in the WRONG thread – please repost 2right1
Anonymous
A Century back, I hope that revival of prophets might have been done in a good manner.
Anonymous
well it kind of past already